WILL they cease to exist?

[eSGEe]

I was reading how fewer and fewer companies (outside China) still make vacuum tubes at all......this made me wonder...........

WILL VACUUM TUBES EVENTUALLY GO AWAY ???

will the ENTIRE WORLD go SOLIDSTATE (digital) --- or Nuclear Jello based amplification ---(whatever the Hell the Norwegian Free Jazz guys are using is AMAZING) =---or will there always and forever be a niche market of tube glowing -- room warming tone junkies who keep the market alive

I mean the PLETHORA (I got a new Funk N Wagnels) of new tech like Fenders Fuse -- Voxs.....er whatever its called-- and the new SPARK amp thing -- make me wonder--- how long can wonky old finicky need tubes swapped-- get too hot -- require SOLDERING! KILL YOU IF YOU TOUCH THE WRONG THING WHEN RUBBING YOUR JUNK ON THE AMP---things LAST?!?!?!

 

[eSGEe]

I will state for the record----Im generally lazy, and simple to much CRAP to stinker around with makes me want a hammer TO FIX IT-- (which leans me toward SS amps---)

however---there is SOMETHING about them tube jobs---- AND the smell of a properly warmed tube--- with a level of dust and dog hair on it---- as it burns off on late winters day--- that fills the room......with --------

oh who am I kidding it smells F-ing horrid----

but-- there is .....another option.........and option unmentioned in the poll (mostly because I felt like poking Norm-- ) ---- the HYBRID!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

part SS -- PArt TUBE ---------------------------all YUMMY

 

[JohnnyGoo]

 

[CabanaBoy]

Tubes are my favorite amps. Not really into hybrids, but I prefer the ones with solid state preamp and tube output if I have a choice. Solid states are ok, but... again... I much prefer tube amps over all.

 

[eSGEe]

thats cause you know how the pixie dust and magic beans work

 

[CabanaBoy]

thats cause you know how the pixie dust and magic beans work

I don't know, man, seems like working on amps is a never ending rabbit hole - I'm sure there is an end to the learning/tweaking somewhere - unlike playing guitar, you can play the guitar your whole life and still learn something from a beginner - lol...

 

[Hackmaster]

I voted that Norm is indeed a shill for Godin.
But I think tubes will outlast us all.
It's supply & demand. Years ago radios, TV's, radar equipment, computers, etc... all used many different kinds of tubes.
Hundreds of different manufacturers in many countries turned em out in droves.
Most, if not all of those devices have been obsoleted by technology and no longer use tubes.
Guitar amps generally use the same preamp tubes, with a few different flavors for power tubes.
So demand is much less now than the "Cold War" days.

But pixie dust and magic beans are always in high demand.

 

[eSGEe]

All of the modeling amps and almost all digital amps for that matter are highly proprietary and you cannot have them fixed by your average in town repair man. Couple that with the fact that being digital means it will eventually be outdated and purposefully obsoleted by a newer platform. Companies cannot afford to support old code on old hardware forever. Tube amps don't suffer this fate.

In addition to that, the Right to Repair Movement looks as though it's losing the war against the titans of industry, who want it to be made illegal for third party entities to be able to repair their products, especially if the manufacturer refuses to do so themselves and instead obliges you to buy a new one. This is precisely Apple's gameplan. They are the biggest opponent of right to repair.

This is precisely why I think tube amps have hung on this long. We are in the new golden age of guitar and tube amps still reign supreme in the studio - where it really counts. The modelers have their place on tour (I've played all the major options,) but someone would have a huge opportunity, and incentive, to produce tubes if China were to suddenly stop. The amps are already out there.

oh SURE go and MAKE sense in the middle of a serious question and answer............oh wait---------where///////////HEY A SQUIRREL................

 

[ivan H]

Tubes, or thermionic valves as they are properly called, ain't going nowhere in the foreseeable future. Various types of valves are used for far more than just audio amplification & new types are still being developed. I would like to see a US or British manufacturer producing real quality tubes again (& take the lion's share of the market from the Russian & Chinese manufacturers).
Cheers
Edit:
The pre-amp & modelling section of modelling amps are pretty much not repairable if a fault develops. Built using mostly SMT (surface mount technology), when they go faulty, the entire circuit board needs to be replaced. Once a replacement circuit board isn't available the amp is pretty well junk. Cheers

 

[syscokid]

I would like to see a US or British manufacturer producing real quality tubes again (& take the lion's share of the market from the Russian & Chinese manufacturers). Cheers

What do you know about the "new" Brimar?

Brimar Thermionic Products (UK) Home Page

Brimar thermionic products - bringing quality valves / tubes, Hi-Fi and guitar amps, valve testers and quality thermionic products to the UK.

brimaruk.com

 

[mcblink]

Tubes aren't going anywhere.

If they do, I pledge to learn as much as possible and begin to manufacture them my damn self.

I might quit playing if I couldn't have a tube amp.

 

[Mr Grumpy]

What do you know about the "new" Brimar?

They make amps too:

 

[67plexi]

All the amps on my workbench now are solid state they die also

 

[ivan H]

What do you know about the "new" Brimar?

Brimar Thermionic Products (UK) Home Page

Brimar thermionic products - bringing quality valves / tubes, Hi-Fi and guitar amps, valve testers and quality thermionic products to the UK.

brimaruk.com

I've been periodically checking on progress since @DonP put me onto the project. Valves currently offered are not manufactured by the new Brimar, rather are "selected" tubes from current manufacturers (not sure which).
I, like many others really hope this project comes to fruition. It would maybe (hopefully) encourage similar endeavours.

Tubes aren't going anywhere.

If they do, I pledge to learn as much as possible and begin to manufacture them my damn self.

Haha, I'd probably be in on that. Cheers

 

[syscokid]

Can the

've been periodically checking on progress since @DonP put me onto the project. Valves currently offered are not manufactured by the new Brimar, rather are "selected" tubes from current manufacturers (not sure which).

Dang, that's kind of disappointing to hear about Brimar. Is it even possible for the U.S. to manufacture vacuum tubes to the quality levels of the 50's and 60's without using materials that have been restricted by U.S. Enviromental Protection Agency?

 

[Chubbles]

I'm an American. When we worry about something we hoard... toilet paper, alcohol, and...

 

[ivan H]

Can the

Dang, that's kind of disappointing to hear about Brimar. Is it even possible for the U.S. to manufacture vacuum tubes to the quality levels of the 50's and 60's without using materials that have been restricted by U.S. Enviromental Protection Agency?

The new Brimar are still gearing up to produce their own valves (small batches), they are still in the process of overhauling tooling & machines, along with wiring everything up etc, etc. As you could imagine, it would be no small project. And then this damn COVID-19 poop thing has slowed work with only a skeleton crew working on the project now. I know we all hope they succeed.
I think it's entirely possible that the USA could produce valves/tubes that would surpasses the current offerings, most definitely. As good as in the heyday without breaching EPA laws, kinda hard to say (y'all could farm "those" processes out to Mexican subsidiary plants). The thing is, no current manufacturers use the "old" cathode coatings, plate coatings etc etc, but that's not what's making the tubes "lesser quality". These guys now are cutting corners all over, use lower quality components all over & quality control is, well, low quality. I mean, just visually compare an old tube to its same new production counterpart. Thinner grid support posts, thinner Mica supports/spacers, poor crimping etc etc. Destructive testing shows thinner glass, plate materials etc etc. Without going on a big (or "bigger") rant, I'm sure y'all get the picture. If they let all these things slide there's a good chance they're letting everything slide, all the while telling us it's a reproduction of your favourite "old production" type. Tubes that previously would not made it through quality control & been discarded are now being shipped. If your supplier doesn't test properly to weed out the poop we end up copping them. The last "decent" tubes were the (Saint Petersburg) SED Winged C's. Could the good ol' US of A produce tubes to rival the SED Winged C's??? Damn straight they could. Cheers

 

[Session 5]

I don't really think they will become obsolete , but I do think SS amps will be more of a choice for the new generation of players. With younger people enjoying electronics more than most of us older guys, they like the ability of changing things electronically so with SS amps changing the tones , sounds , making them sound like even other amps. Its more easier for them to fool around with the computer side of it , than doing labour work fiddling around changing out tubes. This is a large plus over swapping out tubes. There is more advantage with SS with just the click of a mouse. Also the up and coming guitarists because of there sometimes lack of willingness to do physical work, I believe they will want to carry a lighter SS amp over a heavy tube amp, also the younger generation thinks differently than us vintage guys , when something breaks we like to fix it. The younger guys think when it breaks I just buy a new one. This is the advantage to SS amps over tube. SS are lighter, programmable and definitely cheaper. So will tubes become obsolete, I don't think so, but there will be far less being sold going forward into the future.

 

[gball]

The original question didn't address the timeframe. Will they be gone in 5 years? 10 years? 20? Long term, yes, I think they will go away completely. But my feeling is that before then the quality of the available tubes, regardless of current initiatives, will decline to the point that no-one is going to want to use them, in large part because the demand will continue to go down as modeling amps keep getting better. Yes, I think tubes' days are numbered and It will happen in our lifetimes.

 

[WavMixer]

...US or British manufacturer producing real quality tubes again (& take the lion's share of the market from the Russian & Chinese manufacturers).
...

I miss the days of seeing "Made in the USA" on products I buy. Perhaps this COVID-19 ordeal will open the eyes of manufacturers currently outsourcing production to other countries.