What Is He Thinking??? (NGD)

Inspector #20

Inspector #20

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Despite having a huge affinity for 24.75" scale lengths, 12" radii and Les Paul style guitars, I have to admit our recent outdoor performance - in direct sunlight - really opened my eyes to the tuning issues with my 3 Les Paul's . All of them went flat to quite a degree - enough so that I could hear it - but my genuine 2016 Gibson Les Paul was by far the worst offender.

Shockingly, my 1987 Squirecaster - despite being uncomfortably hot to the touch - stayed in perfect tune. Even after several tremolo dives, sufficient to allow the strings to flop along the pickups, the damn thing was still in tune with a crappy, decked, 6 screw tremolo.

While I don't particularly care for the "twang" of a 25.5" scale guitar, I am such a stkicker for accurate tuning, intonation and reliability that it has caused me to re-evaluate my needs for our frequently out of doors performances.

I recall what Adrian Smith said about his tuning issues in high temps with his Les Paul and that while Kirk Hammett uses vintage Les Paul's in the studio, but considers them too unreliable for live work.

I've always been impressed with the Jackson's (both USA and Import) in terms of fretwork, neck rigidity, tuning stability and intonation, and I've had good experiences when I have played them, although I am not a fan of the 'Sharkfin' inlay.

When our TTR homie Esge ended up with a Jackson Adrian Smith model, I was somewhat intrigued. I liked the traditional headstock, and "normal" dot inlay, carbon fiber reinforced neck, a Jackson Super Distortion with a pair of singles, 5 way switching and simple master volume and tone.

I've been doing more tremolo work on recordings, so the idea of a more stable tremolo also appealed to me. Although I'm not a certified Floyd Rose operator, I have always admired Super Strat players like Gillis, DiMartini, and Lynch, But, I just kinda dispelled the notion altogether.

Last Szturday. when I found myself playing my 1987 Squirecaster and 6 screw tremolo with great results, I kind of reconsidered the notion.

No matter how much I love a guitar, it's a big deal breaker with me if I'm constantly retuning and especially when I hear my guitar change pitch during a song.

While I am very happy with my Paul's for studio use, I began to reconsider a Super Strat for live work.

Of interesting note, my solid mahogany double neck, with experimental tongue and groove neck joints by B.Hefner, has rock solid tuning, even in direct sunlight, but its weight makes it impractical for full- time use, as does the 20 fret neck.

One afternoon, Adrian made me an offer that I couldn't refuse...some dough was exchanged and the Jackson was bound for California.

Now, I have no idea how this will transpire, but Adrian speaks highly of the feel, setup and 'mojo' of this guitar and his suggestions have been spot-on in the past, so I'm both excited and nervous for it to arrive this coming week.

Here's a file photo:

2913053576_gtr_frt_001_rr.png

I also have the option of a 24.75" conversion neck in the future should I find myself missing the Paul's too terribly.

Full report to follow...
 
I was following your other post, and it seems weird to me that the guitars would go flat, and not sharp in direct sunlight. I used to do a gig every summer in New Hampshire that was outdoors, and there was no shade. Just set up on a flatbed trailer. I never had issues because by the time we played, my guitars were pretty warm, and adjusted to the days temperature. It's when the sun went down problems would start.

I'm interested in how you find the Jackson to work for you. I think Adrian Smith is an incredible player, and since they do many outdoor shows during the year, he has seen his share of problems with various guitars.
 
SG John said:
I was following your other post, and it seems weird to me that the guitars would go flat, and not sharp in direct sunlight. I used to do a gig every summer in New Hampshire that was outdoors, and there was no shade. Just set up on a flatbed trailer. I never had issues because by the time we played, my guitars were pretty warm, and adjusted to the days temperature. It's when the sun went down problems would start.

I'm interested in how you find the Jackson to work for you. I think Adrian Smith is an incredible player, and since they do many outdoor shows during the year, he has seen his share of problems with various guitars.
Click to expand...

I expected my Paul's to go sharp!!! A luthier chum says the tenon joint "softens" or relaxes, so to speak, in the heat, and the strings have a greater mechanical advantage.

I'm really not sure what to think, but I know a musician that is widely known around here for his genuine 59 Gibson Les Paul. When we discussed the phenomena, he told me he cant keep the 59 in tune in the heat, and it's even been setup by Dan Erlewine.

He uses a PRS Artist Series for outdoor work.
 
Robert Herndon said:
I expected my Paul's to go sharp!!! A luthier chum says the tenon joint "softens" or relaxes, so to speak, in the heat, and the strings have a greater mechanical advantage.

I'm really not sure what to think, but I know a musician that is widely known around here for his genuine 59 Gibson Les Paul. When we discussed the phenomena, he told me he cant keep the 59 in tune in the heat, and it's even been setup by Dan Erlewine.

He uses a PRS Artist Series for outdoor work.
Click to expand...


Odd, it must have something to do with the neck joint. Even though much of the glue is at the sides of the tenon, maybe that little bit between where the neck meets the body is enough to throw it off when the glue softens.
 
Robert Herndon said:
I was reading a blog where some guys were discussing this issue. Most of the time, the Gibson's seem to go sharp in direct sunlight. Some did report going flat with both seasoned strings and following a string change.
Click to expand...

Can you post links to this stuff? I'm really curious now that there have been multiple threads on this subject, and I did a quick search and came up with bupkis.

I've played Les Pauls in direct sunlight/heat/oppressive humidity/all combined more times than I can remember and never had any issues past the first song or so. Guys have been using the things outdoors for live performances since...well, since 1952, and this is not a problem I have ever heard a lot about from any guitar let alone specifically a Les Paul. Even the two guys you mentioned earlier; Adrian Smith plays his goldtop Deluxe at every single gig, inside or out, and Kirk Hammett plays Greenie every night and seems to relish it.
 
@gball I will post up links later on when I get back home.

Here's a couple of just general forum discussions that I still had open where a Les Paul goes both sharp and flat:

Les Paul Studio - will not stay in Tune

I have a 2009 Les Paul Studio with Gold Hardware that will not stay in tune, and is very hard to get into tune. I just put new strings on it, gibson vintage reissue and it is a little better. But just sitting around the 1st three strings go shart, 4 and 5 go flat and 6 does both. No pattern that ...
forum.gibson.com

Les Paul Tuning Issues

I've had my Les Paul Standard for around 4 months now and I still have tuning issues with it. Tune it up at home, go up to the church take it out of the case and the thing has gone sharp. Retune, 10 minutes later it's flat. Makes me wonder if the Autotune system that they had on the 2015 models...
bluesguitarunleashed.com

In an interview video that I posted earlier, Smith said the reason he started looking at Jackson's was because he "couldn't keep his Les Paul in tune."

Now, maybe having to tune between every song is normal, but it's funny in a way that my 1987 Squire - under the same conditions - stayed in tune even using the stock unlocking tremolo.
 
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