Ok, So I Went To Guitar Sinner And Played Some Amps Tonight - Observations:

Inspector #20

Inspector #20

Ambassador of Tone
Fallen Star
Country flag
My local Guitar Sinner had quite a few amps on hand, so I systematically played just about every one of them.

I started with all the Fenders. Hot Rod, Twin Reverb, Blackface, Tweed, Mustang and Champion. All had really great cleans - as one would expect - but none of them really grabbed me.

Played all the Katanas. Very good amp. Lot's of options. Too many knobs and such to suit me. Complicated IMHO.

Played the Mesa Badlander and a Rectoverb, plus a Fillmore 100. Both are great amps. Neither can be run without a Tube Screamer. On their own, very average. just amplification. No color. But, a great pedal platform.

Played Bogners and Orange. Several models of each. Seemed OK, but again, nothing I heard grabbled me.

Line 6. Lots of tones, really good punch from a 1x12 amp. Way too many switches and LED's to suit me. Kinda hard to get a tone out of without reading the manual.

Kemper display model. LOTS of tonal options. probably a great amp for a recording studio. Just didn't grab me. Good tone through the extension cabinet.

Peavey Vyper. Good amp. Lightweight. wasn't blown away by the gain structure. Seemed well built.

Vox AC15 & AC30. Never will understand the appeal of this amp. Basically, just another Fender. Average.

EVH 5150 III Head and EVH 2x12 cab. Really good overdrive structure. Great EQ response, but not tight enough to run without a Tube Screamer, IMHO. Brown Sound was really good. Very mild gain even cranked.

Friedman 112 Vintage 65 watt. Good overdrive structure. Familiar Marshall-esque EQ's. Sounded good. No complaints. Not enough gain on its own to be used without a pedal.

Hughes & Kettner GrandMeister Deluxe 40. This was the big surprise of the night. Really good gain production. Great EQ's and onboard FX like chorus and reverb. I'm just not good with these storable patch or I-pad controlled amps. But. This amp could seriously work without a pedalboard.

Blackstar Venue MkII Club 40 - Surprisingly good amp. Simple, front panel controls a plus. Needs a full pedalboard to really work for me. Blows the Vox AC15 and 30 away in every respect.

Played the Marshall Code 50. I got the best sound with this out of all the amps there. The amp's ability to emulate a speaker cab on the single 12" speaker really thumped. (wait before you jump to conclusions. I'm not advocating this amp, but using it as an means to quantify and observation)

TAKEAWAYS:

I absolutely love chorus and I use it all the time, both clean and dirty. I also like a warm reverb and a 75-100Ms delay. For whatever reason, the fact that this amp was really easy to dial up those tones appealed to me.

However....

I dislike digital amps. I don't like push-to-store-preset anything. I hate top control panel and top output jack amps. To me, it's just waiting for a spilled beer.

So, what, if anything, did I learn???

10 Things I discovered.

1. Plain Jane Amps, like the Mesa Fillmore, or the Blackstar HT Club 40, both do a great job at amplification. But, without my 34" pedalboard, I just can't get a sound that I like.

2. I love AC/DC, but I do not want such a dry tone for myself when I am playing.

3. To get a sound that is pleasing to my ears, I need to have a TS-9 for tightness and additional gain production.

4. Chorus is a HUGE part of my sound

5. I actually miss not having a noise gate

6. Stepping on a boost for solos (Boss GE7) is an integrated part of my sound.

7. I prefer a 2X12 to both a 4X12 and a 1X12

8. A Compressor is also something I miss when it is switched off. More of a note to note balance thing. I do not set them for sustain.

9. My Spray Can Yellow Stratocaster is better than any guitar I pulled down and played (and I demo'd amps with my YeloStrat)

10. My Ivanberg Modded Origin 50 Kills ALL of them for tone, gain production, gain texture and volume - when connected to my 34" pedalboard


So, what else did I learn???


When I hear a tone that I like, I instantly know it. I may HATE that it takes a 34" pedalboard to produce that sound, but I can't get away from those sonic things that grab me.

The 1995-1998 Marshall Valvestate Bi-Chorus Amps (8280 2x12 and 8200 Head) have the best chorus effect I have ever heard. They also have a really deep, 3 spring reverb.

These Valvestate amps also produce sufficient gain structure and tightness that they can be used without a Tube Screamer. (the 8280 and 8200 produce even more gain than my Ivanberg Origin 50)

So, my Ivanberg Origin 50 and 2x12 + 34" board is probably about as good a live tone as I am gonna get.

The Mesa Fillmore 50 works equally well once you add pedals and figure out the complex EQ arrangement.

My ideal "dream" rig would be a Marshall 8200 Bi-Chorus Head, thereby eliminating the Chorus, Tube Screamer and Reverb Pedal from my board - 7 FX instead of 10...maybe even drop down to a 24" board.

Fun way to kill some time...
 
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Robert Herndon said:
I may HATE that it takes a 34" pedalboard to produce that sound, but I can't get away from those sonic things that grab me.
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Embrace the board!

I guess since I started out using floor-based processors, and not actual amplifiers, the idea of having some sort of pedalboard or foot controller just seems normal. After I began using amplifiers, I did try playing without a pedal board, and it felt really weird!

But, nice review.
 
First off, thanks for the in-depth 'review' of sorts.

Secondly, what you learned: we truly are living in a golden age of gear when you can go into a store, try 25+ amps and get so granularly picky that you don't "want to push a button" or plug in a pedal to get a tone you enjoy. This is no longer the days of Marshall or nothing, when the 5150 didn't exist, Mesa only built bass amps that were worth using and Fender was for old farts. The young guns coming up probably don't even have a clue how good they have it gear-wise these days. And, that's not even touching on the quality improvements of entry level guitars over what I started on. It's not IF you can get a tone it's HOW you get the tone that you have the luxury of being picky with here. Love it!

Thirdly, yes, the majority of the new guitars hanging up in your average GC suck, either due to piss poor quality control from the manufacturer or the fact that GC can't be bothered to tune/intonate/set the action before throwing them on the wall with a majorly over-inflated price tag.
 
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Iron1 said:
First off, thanks for the in-depth 'review' of sorts.

Secondly, what you learned: we truly are living in a golden age of gear when you can go into a store, try 25+ amps and get so granularly picky that you don't "want to push a button" or plug in a pedal to get a tone you enjoy. This is no longer the days of Marshall or nothing, when the 5150 didn't exist, Mesa only built bass amps that wear worth using and Fender was for old farts. The young guns coming up probably don't even have a clue how good they have it gear-wise these days. And, that's not even touching on the quality improvements of entry level guitars over what I started on.

Thirdly, yes, the majority of the new guitars hanging up in your average GC suck, either due to piss poor quality control from the manufacturer or the fact that GC can't be bothered to tune/intonate/set the action before throwing them on the wall with a majorly over-inflated price tag.
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You hit on something pretty important here: access to a wide variety. Still to this very day and dating back to the mid 90s when i was a teen getting into music, barely any stores in my area had or still have a nice selection of gear to pick and choose from.

You HAD about 6 stores spread over a 170 mile radius and the choices varied, so you went there knowing that's where you had to go if you wanted a specific brand. Only 2 of them carried Marshalls, one had Mesas, nearly all were carrying Crate, Fender and Peavey. Guitars were equally as spread and i remember only 3 carrying Gibson/Epiphone, 2 had PRS, 2 carried Jackson and nearly all had Fender or Ibanez.

And sadly its worse than that today as we only have about 3 stores spread over the same radius. First time I went to Nashville, i nearly poop my pants as a kid, seeing a shop on every other block with any brand known to mankind lol
 
That is an impressively thorough review, Robert! Thank you!!

Seems like the Ivanberg 50 and the Yellow Strat are the Ideal combination. Which, if any, of other guitars and amps that you tried would come even close when combined?
 
smitty_p said:
Embrace the board!

I guess since I started out using floor-based processors, and not actual amplifiers, the idea of having some sort of pedalboard or foot controller just seems normal. After I began using amplifiers, I did try playing without a pedal board, and it felt really weird!

But, nice review.
Click to expand...

Ugh!!!! The Board!!!!! LOL!!!

20211211_095832.jpg

You make a great point when you said "I did try playing without a pedalboard, and it felt really weird."

I really agree and identify with your statement here.

Gain (or sensitivity as some prefer to say) and the blending of wide chorus are such critical elements of the sound in my head, and i cannot get if from just an amp.

I've covered AC/DC and enjoyed the work, but that dry tone just isn't me.
 
SIx String Chef said:
That is an impressively thorough review, Robert! Thank you!!

Seems like the Ivanberg 50 and the Yellow Strat are the Ideal combination. Which, if any, of other guitars and amps that you tried would come even close when combined?
Click to expand...

I did not play any Gibson's last night. They keep them on the top shelf and you need to ask an emotes to retrieve them with a ladder platform. I stuck with the "self serve" models I could easily reach.

Of all the other guitars I played, the "standouts" again were Jackson and Schecter, with ESP earning honorable mention....all were imported.

I based this statement on overall fit and finish, a quick intonation check and lack of fret buzz, action too high, or other problems that would require setup.

You could have pulled any of these off the hanger and took them straight to a performance.

My thoughts are that because the imported guitars from Indonesia rely on CNC for almost every operation, there is more consistency in them, when compared to a guitar with more "hands on" fitting, IMHO.

My statement - in praise of YelloStrat -was not intended to give it any kind of 'holy grail' status, but just to measure my work against what is hanging in an average Guitar Sinner.

I handed it off to several employees and the consistent theme was how many different tones it produced. The mix of the custom DiMarzio Neanderthal (16.5k AlNico9 44AWG) Humbucker paired with bridge tone, 0.01uf tone capacitors and the bar magnet, screw pole piece hum canceling single coils (8k Alnico 5 Neck and Ceramic 8 Middle) really has such a wide variety of tones and no other guitar on the rack could match it.

The Ivanberg is a little beast. @syscokid and @ivanh are Amp Demigods. Unfortunately, it doesn't "clean up" well, even when the gain is rolled back. This wasn't important when I was working full-time in the Judas Priest Tribute. But now, I'm finding a need for cleans, based on the music we are playing now and my teaching job.

Hmmmm....to address your question about which Amp really stood out...the real "Amp Of The Night" was the $1,400.00 Hughes and Kettner GrandMeister 40. It's a full tube head with a arsenal of onboard FX.

It sounded good at low or high volume, but the reason it impressed me the most was that you could actually leave your 34" pedalboard at home with this one.


Now, having said that, I doubt I could justify shelling out $1,400 for a head when a 1998 Marshall Valvestate Bi-Chorus 8200 makes me 100% content, but it was a surprisingly great amp...
 
Iron1 said:
First off, thanks for the in-depth 'review' of sorts.

Secondly, what you learned: we truly are living in a golden age of gear when you can go into a store, try 25+ amps and get so granularly picky that you don't "want to push a button" or plug in a pedal to get a tone you enjoy. This is no longer the days of Marshall or nothing, when the 5150 didn't exist, Mesa only built bass amps that were worth using and Fender was for old farts. The young guns coming up probably don't even have a clue how good they have it gear-wise these days. And, that's not even touching on the quality improvements of entry level guitars over what I started on. It's not IF you can get a tone it's HOW you get the tone that you have the luxury of being picky with here. Love it!

Thirdly, yes, the majority of the new guitars hanging up in your average GC suck, either due to piss poor quality control from the manufacturer or the fact that GC can't be bothered to tune/intonate/set the action before throwing them on the wall with a majorly over-inflated price tag.
Click to expand...

Great points!!!!

Back when I started, music stores didn't carry much and there was a limited selection in the industry.

But, I also noticed how many guys were trading in gear that was recently purchased for pennies on the dollar.

I saw lots of people buying amps and guitars without really demoing them.
 
Clockworkmike said:
You hit on something pretty important here: access to a wide variety. Still to this very day and dating back to the mid 90s when i was a teen getting into music, barely any stores in my area had or still have a nice selection of gear to pick and choose from.

You HAD about 6 stores spread over a 170 mile radius and the choices varied, so you went there knowing that's where you had to go if you wanted a specific brand. Only 2 of them carried Marshalls, one had Mesas, nearly all were carrying Crate, Fender and Peavey. Guitars were equally as spread and i remember only 3 carrying Gibson/Epiphone, 2 had PRS, 2 carried Jackson and nearly all had Fender or Ibanez.

And sadly its worse than that today as we only have about 3 stores spread over the same radius. First time I went to Nashville, i nearly poop my pants as a kid, seeing a shop on every other block with any brand known to mankind lol
Click to expand...

Exactly!!!!

We had to drive to the next "big town" over to buy anything more than picks and strings!!!!
 
Not for nothing, but a modern AC15 or AC30 has nothing in common with those made in the sixties. Especially the sound. There is no comparison to the old Goodmans or Alnico Blues that came with the originals, or the circuits with old Mullard or Telefunken tubes.

Like Plexi says, cheap commie junk.

With a proper AC30, not only should it sound great, but you should be able to fry a steak on it while you're playing. My custom made reproduction of Rory's amp will heat a room when playing it, and it sounds fabulous.
 
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