Ohm setting question

Inspector #20 said:
Interesting!!!

Why do you think that is???

When i stopped using Creambacks and Greenbacks, i quit blowing up speakers.

Electro-Harmonix 12VR75 i found to be indestructible.

WGS Reaper 55Hz also was impervious to damage from high volume and high resonance settings. I still have one here somewhere...

Italian-Made Jensen Stealth 80 and Jensen 100 Watt Tornado Neodymium models also never failed.
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Decent point really. I have never personally blown a speaker, despite pushing them to death in the same cabs for about 20-25 years now. But then again, all of mine at Celestion T-75s and K100s, dunno if that's the difference. On the other hand though, my buddy @froman5150 did have a Marshall Classic Reissue cab with Greenbacks and blew out one within just a few years. He switched to a 1960B Cab with T-75s too and has had them for almost 20 years now
 
Amp Mad Scientist said:
I have never seen a "speaker test" video,
where the video shows the REAL pro method of testing speakers.

They always show part of it, and never follow through with ALL of it.

"check speakers for scraping voice coils"
They will not do it.

check cabinet input jack, with a flex test.....for solid continuity.
they will not do it....

Test speaker cable with a flex test.....nope.

Test amp speaker jack for solid continuity...........no.

It's just a fact.
Not even the tech who repairs the blown up amp will test the speakers.
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Ampmad,

I cannot vouch for any or all " test" videos " NOT SHOWING" the PRO method.
---You will have to go into detail on how a Pro does it for me.

I have seen some videos showing checking for Voice Coil scraping,
--But you will have to tell me the way you would do for that too. I know about this,but can only gauge if I do it right once you tell me how.

The Cabinet input jack and speaker cable flex test, I can picture what it is and certainly know WHY it is important.
My guess is to prevent incidents of 0 load scenarios. So if you can explain how to do each test. Thanks

As for " Just the fact... Amp Techs won't test speakers... I believe it as I wound up diagnosing a problem my 4 hole JMP amp had after it acted up twice within a few minutes of a tech "fixing" the head on 2 trips to him. I lost faith in him after the 2nd trip revealed some dishonesty and lack of integrity.

SO, needless to say, I am curious about your methods for the speakers/important components in the chain testing procedures.

Thanks,

PS. THANKS again for the Electronics books. Lots of DEEP knowledge in them. The basics I know can surely benefit from poring over these books and trying to link all the principles, jargon and components.
 
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Clockworkmike said:
Decent point really. I have never personally blown a speaker, despite pushing them to death in the same cabs for about 20-25 years now. But then again, all of mine at Celestion T-75s and K100s, dunno if that's the difference. On the other hand though, my buddy @froman5150 did have a Marshall Classic Reissue cab with Greenbacks and blew out one within just a few years. He switched to a 1960B Cab with T-75s too and has had them for almost 20 years now
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Well Mike,there is a difference between a 4x12 100 watt cab with 4-25 watt speakers, vs a 4x12 with 4- 75 watters.
I have had both.

I will also add that I have to make sure I put my speaker cord into the 16 ohm jack and have the switch in the Mono position and set things to 16 ohm on my amp head I use.
To have these Marshall Stereo cabs in Stereo setting brings about the condition of only one pair of the speakers being active, and then cutting the impedance to 8 ohm. I avoid problems by putting tape over the one jack and setting the switch and taping it from being moved too.

287759.jpg
 
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chilipeppermaniac said:
Well, there is a difference between a 4x12 100 watt cab with 4-25 watt speakers, vs a 4x12 with 4- 75 watters.
I have had both.
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True, but at the proper impedance a 100w cab should hold up against a 100w head, granted you dont over push it with an overdrive then max it's output. People used them for decades like that without issue. But being merely 25w per speaker, it doesn't take a whole lot to blow one, especially being driven by a 100w amp.

Due to that issue alone, while I like the sound of Greenbacks, I'd rather not use them personally. Well least not a full cab of them, maybe mixing with other speakers like a lot of folks do.

I run 50watter heads into 300 and 400w cabs, so there's almost no risk of blowing the speakers. I have a 350w head but it's into a 400w cab as well
 
Clockworkmike said:
Decent point really. I have never personally blown a speaker, despite pushing them to death in the same cabs for about 20-25 years now. But then again, all of mine at Celestion T-75s and K100s, dunno if that's the difference. On the other hand though, my buddy @froman5150 did have a Marshall Classic Reissue cab with Greenbacks and blew out one within just a few years. He switched to a 1960B Cab with T-75s too and has had them for almost 20 years now
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High volume with heavy resonance and bass-heavy EQ settings.

When i returned the speakers to Celestion, they told me there was "no way you blew the cones off the voice coils with only 40 watts..."

They changed that story when i sent them a video of my rig.

As @Mitch Pearrow SJMP how loud - and percussive - my live rig was. It would make your nose run.
chilipeppermaniac said:
Robert, Were you running these as a 4x12 or a 1x, 2x or what? I can't remember.
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1 x12, 2 x12 and 4x12 at one point.

Funny, my 30 year old Jackson 4x12 with Eminence speakers - rated at 200 watts - could handle it no problem.

20210307_120517.jpg

Creambacks and Greenbacks distort so much - normally - that you cant really yell when you've hurt them.

I ultimately bought (8) Celestions, which have no guarantee through Sweetwater - and lost a lot of money before i stopped listening to the hype surrounding them.

UK Made Celestion Copperback 250's eliminate all those problems.

20220602_045314.jpg

The 1993 Marshall Valvestate Bi-Chorus 200 is very hard on speakers...

20211229_210918.jpg

Lesson learned...

Zakk Wylde uses EVM-12L-BLS for a reason...
 
Clockworkmike said:
True, but at the proper impedance a 100w cab should hold up against a 100w head, granted you dont over push it with an overdrive then max it's output. People used them for decades like that without issue. But being merely 25w per speaker, it doesn't take a whole lot to blow one, especially being driven by a 100w amp.

Due to that issue alone, while I like the sound of Greenbacks, I'd rather not use them personally. Well least not a full cab of them, maybe mixing with other speakers like a lot of folks do.

I run 50watter heads into 300 and 400w cabs, so there's almost no risk of blowing the speakers. I have a 350w head but it's into a 400w cab as well
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YES, I would definitely avoid running a 100 Watt Amp into a 100 watt cab at too high a volume. My main Heads are 50 watters too.
 
chilipeppermaniac said:
I was also hearing that recent Celestion speakers were Chinese made. Could have a bearing on Blown tendencies too.
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Yeah I know their Celestion Original series is all Chinese unfortunately. Celestion themselves swear that is the only line that sources out of China but honestly, it wouldn't shock me if they haven't began slipping some of their classic speakers thru those production lines
 
The first thing you have to do is take all the speakers out.
(unless the grill cloth is removable)
That's the only way to inspect the speakers for voice coil scraping, and what ever other damage there may be.

Then you have the chance to vacuum the dust or other stuff out of there.
(sometimes it's cockroach eggs)
(sometimes it's gecko eggs)

But just that amount of effort is enough to stop most people.

Normally I will take the speakers out, especially if there has been major amp damage.
If it was a bad speaker, I don't need it to blow up again.....and piss off the customer.
The speakers need to be corrected before the amp is used.
 
Inspector #20 said:
Some are China Made i understand.

I blew up several UK Made variants of the Creambacks and Greenbacks.

They are the AMC Gremlin of speakers.
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I will not add any commentary on good vs bad sound, reliability of Cream vs Green vs yadda speakers, except to post a link to a speaker conversation, results, tests, arguments, discussions etc found here, and at any other interesting places I find. You guys can derive your own conclusions based on the messages and personal experiences.


 
Amp Mad Scientist said:
The first thing you have to do is take all the speakers out.
(unless the grill cloth is removable)
That's the only way to inspect the speakers for voice coil scraping, and what ever other damage there may be.

Then you have the chance to vacuum the dust or other stuff out of there.
(sometimes it's cockroach eggs)
(sometimes it's gecko eggs)

But just that amount of effort is enough to stop most people.

Normally I will take the speakers out, especially if there has been major amp damage.
If it was a bad speaker, I don't need it to blow up again.....and piss off the customer.
The speakers need to be corrected before the amp is used.
Click to expand...
Thank you, Ampmad. I read 5 words, now will digest your post.
 
Amp Mad Scientist said:
The first thing you have to do is take all the speakers out.
(unless the grill cloth is removable)
That's the only way to inspect the speakers for voice coil scraping, and what ever other damage there may be.

Then you have the chance to vacuum the dust or other stuff out of there.
(sometimes it's cockroach eggs)
(sometimes it's gecko eggs)

But just that amount of effort is enough to stop most people.

Normally I will take the speakers out, especially if there has been major amp damage.
If it was a bad speaker, I don't need it to blow up again.....and piss off the customer.
The speakers need to be corrected before the amp is used.
Click to expand...

This much I have definitely done before.

As @Thatbastarddon does next: He posts that guy eating popcorn Meme to wait for the rest of the story.
 
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