Session 5
Ambassador of Strings & Wings
Interesting read in our local news this morning
- Thread starter Session 5
- Start date
Sapient
Ambassador of Vocal Inspiration
"What bugs me most about EVs is the sanctimony around them — that somehow they’re a more moral choice — and the compulsory way the Trudeau government is forcing them on us."
It's here too, and everywhere. It's called Globalism and is all under the same brand: Khazarian agenda.
It's here too, and everywhere. It's called Globalism and is all under the same brand: Khazarian agenda.
gball
Ambassador of Boogie
You know this little trope that the luddites love to repeat was debunked a long time ago, right? Over their lifespan current electric cars will result in approximately 30% lower carbon emissions than gas-powered vehicles. That number will improve over time as the technogies improve.
I can only imagine the pushback in the early days of automobiles, when people were reluctant to give up horse-drawn conveyances because of the cost and fear of adopting new technologies and the concerns about range and refueling. I don't know how we ever got past it.
I don't fear anything, i just choose to not subscribe blindly to what the media preaches to me.
The entire EV debauchery has become entirely political. Its no longer a question of practicality. Its a self-ordained elitist sect of society who have determined that their likes should be imposed upon humanity as a whole.
You have politicians investing in EV technology, then following up with attemps to mandate EV through legislation, and the elitist populace is so blinded by their climate change mantra that they are blind to the connection.
This kind of thing is exactly why I'm now in law school.
I worked for the government and i can tell you that its all a shell game.
Last edited:
We must not overlook the dark side of electric vehicles
Grace Blackshaw explores the environmental and ethical impacts of electric vehicle batteries, and argues that “technological innovation done in the name of ‘sustainability’ means nothing if marred by inju
I don’t see how it is debunked ? Where is the electricity coming from? Can’t be solar unless more batteries are added as most people will be charging over night to get to work the next day. Wind is unreliable so back up generation systems are needed (natural gas and coal) . Hydro is pretty consistent but that’s only gonna supply a few spots around the globe. Any time you convert one energy source to another you lose energy, basic law of physics.
Don’t get me wrong, I like the EV idea but you have to have the big picture on solving the issue at hand. Simply making more EVs without investing in a clean energy source, and nuclear is pretty darn green, then the charging energy sources are going to make more pollution than the ICE (you have to take the whole EV life cycle into account). From a Systems Engineering perspective they aren’t there yet, but if they can solve the power generation side of the issue (fusion in the future could do that) then we are talking win-win if the costs can be scaled for real mass production of the EVs so people can afford them. And battery technology has to vastly improve too, but that can be engineered over time like the ICE was.
Exactly. Hence, the reason fossil-fueled automobiles are so inefficient. Yes, you lose energy in the conversion of fossil fuels to electricity. But, the conversion of electrical energy to mechanical energy via the electric motor is extremely efficient - between 80% and 85%. Contrast that with the waste of the internal combustion engine, itself. The vast majority of the energy within the gasoline is never converted to mechanical energy at the wheels. Internal combustion energy efficiency is in the range of 25% - 35%, often less if a vehicle is not well maintained.
You also lose energy in the refinement of crude oil to gasoline.
ibmorjamn
Ambassador of Moar Jammin
Very well said Robert!
I convert gasoline into cool sounds....
My daily driver is a joyful experience.
4.30 gears, 5 speed manual, and the throttle is programmed for 25° of throttle plate movement for ever 10° of pedal movement.
At 1/2 throttle pedal movement, the engine is essentially wife - the F - open.
The car feels faster than it really is.
To me, its all about my right to peaceful enjoyment.
Last edited:
ibmorjamn
Ambassador of Moar Jammin
My Yaris gets 41 mpg. Thats 410 miles to 10 gl. Helz Bells , the car is 4 years old. No company is trying to get better milage with gas except Toyota. It is more profitable to throw technology in the trash for something in long term will likely not achieve the goal.
I would like to simply reserve my right to drive anything that i want, without a government entity, imposing punitive sanctions, in an attempt to force a politicized agenda - under color of environmental reform - upon the general populace.
If you want to drive an EV, you should not be penalized, or otherwise prevented from doing so, and, to that end, if you wish to drive a gasoline fueled car, then you should be likewise free from any penalty in doing so.
If you want to drive an EV, you should not be penalized, or otherwise prevented from doing so, and, to that end, if you wish to drive a gasoline fueled car, then you should be likewise free from any penalty in doing so.
OP
Session 5
Ambassador of Strings & Wings
EVs aren’t much better. The conversion of a primary energy source to electricity is around a 60% loss. So if you start with 100 units of energy (BTUs, joules, etc) you have 40 after converting to electricity. Then take 85% of that and you are at 34% efficient going from the primary energy source to mechanical energy.
EVs aren’t much better. The conversion of a primary energy source to electricity is around a 60% loss. So if you start with 100 units of energy (BTUs, joules, etc) you have 40 after converting to electricity. Then take 85% of that and you are at 34% efficient going from the primary energy source to mechanical energy.
Here's what a lot of people don't know about Tesla in particular. I know the ins and outs because i worked for them.
The battery warranty only guarantees a battery that will retain 70% of its capacity. So, if your battery fails, you will get a used battery that has not degraded past 70% and not a new battery like most people think.
And intermal Tesla study, on 286 Tesla P Model owners across the world, revealed that Tesla vehicles lose over 5% of their battery capacity in the first 50,000 miles of use.
Standard Model 3 range is advertised as 270 miles.
So, if your battery is 75%, then thats inly 202 miles.
Tesla internal documents state that range can be reduced by 41% on average when the temperature drops from 75 degrees Fahrenheit to 20 degrees and the climate control system is used to heat the cabin. This was posted in a January 20, 2023 cars.com article.
I have several colleagues in Palm Springs who dumped their Teslas due to significantly decreased range in hot weather.
To each their own...
jtees4
Well-Known Member
I do not have any problem with electric vehicles, in fact I like some of them but I have a big problem with the govt. mandating anything. Also what good is electric vehicles when our infrastructure can't handle our electric usage already? I'm old, so it's easy for me to remember when the air actually was really bad, mostly in the 70's, 80's (lived in NYC at that time). Anyone living there (and other big cities) at that time knows full well that the air and water is cleaner now than it was then. You can swim in places where no one would go into the water back then. You can eat fish from places you wouldn't dare back in those days. Sorry, it's just true. Having said that, when the US mandates things and doesn't explain how it's going to get China, India, etc. to go along and join with it, it's not going to happen. As we stop coal, China and other big countries expanded their usage....sure, that'll change things, not.
I am a huge proponent of having smog equipment on older vehicles, which is largely regarded as a bad thing by enthusiasts.
Many people in SoCal remove the catalysts from modern cars to get more noise and you can smell the eye-burning exhaust while sitting in traffic.
jtcnj
Ambassador of the Crossroad
The China, India, etc issue is the key. If this is a global climate issue, then all must be on board.
There is no benefit to force this extreme push to EV in the USA, Canada, western Europe, etc. when other big players in the world are not trying AT ALL.
China is opening new coal plants all the time.
I'm not against developing technologies, but this push in not based on solid planning based on the technology and infrastructure readiness.
Why do the hard pro EV folks always dismiss those that question this?
Why do they never acknowledge or address the legitimate questions raised?
They just push on with their talking points and call those that disagree flat-earthers, etc.
It is a good thing to lead toward a more environmentally responsible care of earth, but this is leading us off a cliff.
There is no benefit to force this extreme push to EV in the USA, Canada, western Europe, etc. when other big players in the world are not trying AT ALL.
China is opening new coal plants all the time.
I'm not against developing technologies, but this push in not based on solid planning based on the technology and infrastructure readiness.
Why do the hard pro EV folks always dismiss those that question this?
Why do they never acknowledge or address the legitimate questions raised?
They just push on with their talking points and call those that disagree flat-earthers, etc.
It is a good thing to lead toward a more environmentally responsible care of earth, but this is leading us off a cliff.