BFT Gibson
Ambassador of Originality
As the final gear assembly is being done before serious retirement effort. Is the Hiwatt sound the missing thing in our tone arsenal?
Are WE really -possibly-- missing Hiwatt
- Thread starter BFT Gibson
- Start date
OP
BFT Gibson
Ambassador of Originality
Would you say a Hiwatt voicing (probably talking clean as only way to really tell)
Would you say its more open than fender or more character without the massive mid scoop. The thing i noticed on the Hiwatt in video was notes ringing out pretty clear almost individual stand out alone at times. Hard to tell bot being in the room, but think i am hearing something there i liked.
SG John
Ambassador of Cool Guitars and Amps.
I love Johan's videos. He does his best to give everything their best opportunity to shine. The Fane Crescendo speakers he's using are a very specialized speaker. Most people don't like them. They only reason anyone uses or seeks them is the David Gilmour connection. There's a guy in England, Chris Hewitt, who is reproducing the WEM cabinets with new Fane Crescendos. They are not for the faint of wallet, but if you're in The Australian Pink Floyd or other tribute bands, you're buying them. He also owns most of the original Isle of Wight festival backline. He displays it at shows in Europe, and has put out a coffee table book of Hiwatt/WEM gear.
I like the purple back Fanes in my '71 cabinet. They have the lows and mids that the Marshall cabs are missing. They are very well rounded, and work well with any of my amps. A big part of the Hiwatt sound is the cabinet, and especially the Fane speakers. Right now, a good 4122 or 4123 cabinet with the correct speakers will cost you as much, or more than an unmolested DR103. The other part of the equation like Steve says, is the Partridge transformers.
I like how Johan included bands like the Soundtrack of Our Lives and The Hives. Too bad he missed Foghat, Slade, Jethro Tull, and many other Hiwatt users. With The Soundtrack of Our Lives, Mattias Bärjed plays SG Specials and other Gibsons with P94s replacing the humbuckers into Hiwatts and sometimes Vox AC30s along with the Hiwatt. Ian Person on the other hand is usually playing humbucker loaded Les Pauls and ES335s into old Marshalls along with an occasional Fender Showman. Live, it is a massive wall of sound. Especially with keys and the rhythm section behind them. With Jethro Tull, Martin Barre always played a Les Paul Standard or Special, and the occasional SG Junior or Special straight into Hiwatt stacks. He didn't use pedals. The "Aqualung" sound and solo is all a '59 Les Paul Standard into a Hiwatt that's dimed.
They are great amps, but absolutely painfully loud to use sometimes. I love mine. I can use it at practice and also for recording, but I think a soundman will try to kill me if I show up at a small club with it. Like Gilmour says, "with a Hiwatt, you can lean back and the sound will hold you up."
The bottom head is the one you want. 50 watts might be better, but the sound is sooooo good with this head.
Whatever head, it must have a pair of these trannies.
These are the speakers that Johan should have used in the video. They are the ones you would find in a period correct cabinet from the seventies. Purple back Fanes rule!
I like the purple back Fanes in my '71 cabinet. They have the lows and mids that the Marshall cabs are missing. They are very well rounded, and work well with any of my amps. A big part of the Hiwatt sound is the cabinet, and especially the Fane speakers. Right now, a good 4122 or 4123 cabinet with the correct speakers will cost you as much, or more than an unmolested DR103. The other part of the equation like Steve says, is the Partridge transformers.
I like how Johan included bands like the Soundtrack of Our Lives and The Hives. Too bad he missed Foghat, Slade, Jethro Tull, and many other Hiwatt users. With The Soundtrack of Our Lives, Mattias Bärjed plays SG Specials and other Gibsons with P94s replacing the humbuckers into Hiwatts and sometimes Vox AC30s along with the Hiwatt. Ian Person on the other hand is usually playing humbucker loaded Les Pauls and ES335s into old Marshalls along with an occasional Fender Showman. Live, it is a massive wall of sound. Especially with keys and the rhythm section behind them. With Jethro Tull, Martin Barre always played a Les Paul Standard or Special, and the occasional SG Junior or Special straight into Hiwatt stacks. He didn't use pedals. The "Aqualung" sound and solo is all a '59 Les Paul Standard into a Hiwatt that's dimed.
They are great amps, but absolutely painfully loud to use sometimes. I love mine. I can use it at practice and also for recording, but I think a soundman will try to kill me if I show up at a small club with it. Like Gilmour says, "with a Hiwatt, you can lean back and the sound will hold you up."
The bottom head is the one you want. 50 watts might be better, but the sound is sooooo good with this head.
Whatever head, it must have a pair of these trannies.
These are the speakers that Johan should have used in the video. They are the ones you would find in a period correct cabinet from the seventies. Purple back Fanes rule!
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SG John
Ambassador of Cool Guitars and Amps.
I think he totally missed it when I saw that a while back. His Orange video was also not very good. At least the history and development part.
There’s a 1973 50w on Reverb with those trannies.
Hiwatt Custom 50 DR504 1973 Collector Grade | Reverb
Beautiful 1973 Hiwatt Custom 50 DR504 in collector grade ‘Mint’ condition.S/N: 4091This is a unique opportunity to purchase an all original Hylight era Hiwatt Custom 50 with Partridge transformers, mustard caps, Bulgin socket, Mullard pre-amp & output valves and military spec wiring etc and i...
reverb.com
OP
BFT Gibson
Ambassador of Originality
Very cool SG, you brought up such a valid point with the volume. This the first time ever i been in my LR with volume down. Luckily in a short time realized my missing tone wasn't my gear, it was simply volume. Being pretty much a strait up circuit player & guitar knob rider ,,maybe a boost when needed, The volume is huge in the final result of how the amps we love were designed to sound the best.
So let me pose a question. And I don’t really have an answer. I totally get when you guys play on a postage stamp stage. The amp and cabinets are everything. You may or may not be mic’d for going thru the house. I’m betting most of you could tell listening if they were Marshall or Hiwatt of Fender of whatever amps without looking.
But in a big venue where everything gets run thru the house. You have a guy in the back doing the EQ thing to get rid of unwanted feedback. Tuning for the room. Changing it up again after 12,000 bodies occupy space and suck up the sound. If I’m standing/sitting 100-200 feet from the stage. Volume is at 110db or more. Clean guitar is just in one's imagination. Can you really tell what amps being used?
But in a big venue where everything gets run thru the house. You have a guy in the back doing the EQ thing to get rid of unwanted feedback. Tuning for the room. Changing it up again after 12,000 bodies occupy space and suck up the sound. If I’m standing/sitting 100-200 feet from the stage. Volume is at 110db or more. Clean guitar is just in one's imagination. Can you really tell what amps being used?
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gball
Ambassador of Boogie
Honestly, I defy anyone to tell straight up precisely which amp is being used in a band setting. There are just far too many variables, and while the subtleties may make a difference for the player, to some extent, once the drummer kicks in its all over as far as the finer details, other than does it cut through the mix or not.
Anyway, that being said, I have a buddy that is a Hiwatt nut and the best sounding one he has is a...Reeves Custom 100.
OP
BFT Gibson
Ambassador of Originality
heck these days it might even be a backing track...
Funny you should say that. Was watching something where Pete Townshend was being interviewed. Among other things, he was talking about making the song “Won’t Get Fooled Again.” There were only four of them on stage when they played live. So the keyboard part of that song is basically a backing track used for playing live. That was early 70’s.
OP
BFT Gibson
Ambassador of Originality
I sat behind the sound booth for a concert & watched the laptops being worked by the sound guy. As integral part of a modern day concert as the musician i guess.
Running the board is as much an art form as the people on stage making the music. It is a seriously underrated job.
30 years ago I did the board in the little church I went to. I think there were 8 channels. I had control of 4 mics. Two over the choir. One for the pulpit. And a lapel for the preacher. Plus a cassette deck we used for “canned” music for choir or soloist. No need to amplify the piano or organ. It was fun.
67plexi
Ambassador of Amps
1982-1983 I was a sound man our PA was 64,000 watts the Bass player used two Ampeg SVT and the guitarist
used two HI Watt full stacks the 200 watt version sounded amassing 11/83 I moved to Alaska got a phone call to go on the road
I turned it down so did Brad Turner our drummer we are still alive.
I only have one Fane speaker a Studio 12L sounds great.
used two HI Watt full stacks the 200 watt version sounded amassing 11/83 I moved to Alaska got a phone call to go on the road
I turned it down so did Brad Turner our drummer we are still alive.
I only have one Fane speaker a Studio 12L sounds great.
gball
Ambassador of Boogie
I love Fanes. Have had a 1x12 with one and a 4x12 Laney cab with them. Not sure of the model numbers, and it was a long time ago, but I remember loving how they sounded.
bea
AmBASSador of the F Clef
You are aware that more or less every high quality audio transfomer of ANY manufacturer is to a big degree a Partridge transformer. Simply because it was Jim Partridge who had introduced the interleaved wiring technique which is used in more or less all high quality audio transformers. AFAIK, that was in the 50s.
Somewhere on Hiwatt.org You can read that the specific tone of the amp mainly comes from the characteristics of its tone stack. So put a Hiwat tone stack into a different clean sounding amp like a Fender Bassman top, and it will sound very hiwattisch.
Apparently, the main property of that tone stack is the characteristic position of its mid hole which covers a markably lower frequency band than the Fender tone stack. For my Little Bea_R project I actually modeled that property with a *very* different tone stack design (an AMZ tone control combined with an adjustable passive notch filter) - and it does indeed sound very close to my big Hiwatt clone
(a Weber Mywatt 200).
BTW: a recent photo of me rehearsing on my Mywatt stack (with two TL606/15L-alike cabs). Sticking out right of the big tower Little Bea_R on my 212 cab.
