Alas! And My Tone Escapes Me:

Col Mustard said:
that will work fine... the rest is up to you. *grins
Click to expand...

Interesting, Colonel...

When I installed the twin PAF style pickups in my 1987 Stratocaster, I originally installed the generic, GFS nickel covered pickups of 8.6k and 8.0k ohms impedance. Then, I installed the genuine Gibson 57 Classics, which are around 7.5k each. The GFS pickups are actually quieter than the 57 Classics....

I have decided that I am going to wind my own pickups from now on....I believe my eye (and ear) for detail is better than many of these factory workers...

57 Classics.jpg
 
Played quite a bit last night.....The Schecter's master tone control (a factory Bourne's Carbon Potentiometer, is very smooth and responsive. The EMG's drive a tube amp so hard, you really have to drop the guitar's volume and tone to keep from sounding like Dave Mustaine.

I think I am now at peace with my tone....
 
Robert, I would twist that bass knob clockwise on the amp. Should make your tone thicker. You have mids on the amp ? Turn back some treble.
In the last vids you posted, you do seem to have that one single tone going. Experiment. Go to extremes and come back slowly. Get out of your comfort zone.

Listen to it here. Go to 4:19
Way rounder than what you have. Maybe the Marshall is not the amp for that kind of sound ? I dunno, I don't own a Marshall.
 
BGood said:
Robert, I would twist that bass knob clockwise on the amp. Should make your tone thicker. You have mids on the amp ? Turn back some treble.
In the last vids you posted, you do seem to have that one single tone going. Experiment. Go to extremes and come back slowly. Get out of your comfort zone.

Listen to it here. Go to 4:19
Way rounder than what you have. Maybe the Marshall is not the amp for that kind of sound ? I dunno, I don't own a Marshall.
Click to expand...

I agree. My tone is single-coil thin to my ears!!!! Don is using a Twin Reverb here...as he does at all his live shows.

here is my complete setup from the video:

No distortion pedals EVER!

Marshall DSL40C - Gain 1/2, Bass full, Mid 1/2, Treble 1-O'clock, Presence full, Resonance 1/2

(sometimes I run a second DSL40C via A/B switch with identical settings - I also run a 1997 Marshall VS265 2x12 hybrid combo when chorus is desired - I run all three sometimes split at the DD-3)

(ALL effects modified by Modest Mike for quiet operation - Awesome!!!)

Boss CS-3 No added gain - used to clarify and 'polish' the signal - no settings beyond 1/2

Boss GE-7 all tones enhanced for clarity - inverted 'V' shape - no added gain

Boss DD-3 - 800 ms - 3 repeats

BOSS NS-2 light noise suppression

Ferrite cores around amp power cable and around guitar cable between last effect and amp (a long time studio technique for EFI/noise reduction)

I AM CONVINCED the thinness is the PICKUPS!!!!
 
Hi Robert, if I may make a suggestion, turn down the treble a little, & the mids up. The treble control acts as a balance control between the high frequencies & the mid & low frequencies, regardless of where the mid & low controls are set. The signal from the tone stack is passed on to the next stage via the treble pots wiper, or variable connection. So you can turn the mids & lows up but if the treble is up high it is still passing a balance of mainly high frequencies. With Marshalls I've found I always have the mids up higher than the treble. Another thing I like is the presence on zero, or near to as it keeps the power amp nice & tight, but that's a personal taste thing. Hope this helps. Cheers
 
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Just been looking at the Marshall tab on the app. The nearest setting you can get to flat is

Bass 1
Mid 10
Treble just over 1
 
Robert Herndon said:
I believe my eye (and ear) for detail is better than many of these factory workers...
Click to expand...

That comment kind of bothers me. They don't design the pickups, after all. No need to put them down.

Robert Herndon said:
I think I am now at peace with my tone....
Click to expand...

Excellent!!!

So, it seems EMGs are your thing. Awesome!

Active pickups seem to be your tone zone. I think EMGs are often under-appreciated as anything other than a heavy metal pickup. They're actually quite versatile.


Robert Herndon said:
Making my own pickups from now on....
Click to expand...

I thought you just said you found your tone with the EMGs?

***bangs head on wall***

But, making your own is sure to be a fun opportunity to learn and explore, so more power to you.

I've contemplated doing the same thing to make my own mini-humbuckers, but I don't feel like spending the money for a good winding machine.

Maybe, instead of a "Von Herndon" Strat, you should do "Von Herndon" pickups!

That would be cool.


Robert Herndon said:
Marshall DSL40C - Gain 1/2, Bass full, Mid 1/2, Treble 1-O'clock, Presence full, Resonance 1/2

(sometimes I run a second DSL40C via A/B switch with identical settings - I also run a 1997 Marshall VS265 2x12 hybrid combo when chorus is desired - I run all three sometimes split at the DD-3)

(ALL effects modified by Modest Mike for quiet operation - Awesome!!!)

Boss CS-3 No added gain - used to clarify and 'polish' the signal - no settings beyond 1/2

Boss GE-7 all tones enhanced for clarity - inverted 'V' shape - no added gain

Boss DD-3 - 800 ms - 3 repeats

BOSS NS-2 light noise suppression

Ferrite cores around amp power cable and around guitar cable between last effect and amp (a long time studio technique for EFI/noise reduction)

I AM CONVINCED the thinness is the PICKUPS!!!!
Click to expand...

Presence on full? That does seem like a formula for allowing some spikiness through, depending on the guitar.

I do have a question. Are you adjusting your amp for each guitar, or just keeping the amp settings the same? I've found that I can't really expect to use different guitars without, sometimes, having to make some adjustments to the amp for that guitar. Think of it like this, when you plug your guitar into an amp, that guitar's components become part of the entire circuitry. The amp and guitar are not separate. They now are mated as one complete, electronic/audio system. In one sense, you are really "playing" the amp. Your guitar really becomes just a pitch controller. So, you likely have to manipulate the amp to achieve a desired tone with a given guitar, since you've now inserted different components into the circuit.

Another thing, when I'm setting up patches and sounds, I leave the effects out of the equation until I get the guitar/amp setup in the neighborhood. Then, I add the effects. I may still have to go back and tweak the amp after adding the effects, but I try to get just the guitar and amp as close as I can, first.

I do like your approach of using no distortion pedals and letting the amp gain do its thing. Sometimes, I'll add a Tubescreamer to provide a little extra push or girth, but I really prefer the amp's organic overdrive.

But, I'll go back to your obvious preference for EMGs. Those seem to be the only p'ups for which you've consistently expressed praise and satisfaction. Maybe, they're just your thing.
 
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smitty_p said:
That comment kind of bothers me. They don't design the pickups, after all. No need to put them down.



Excellent!!!

So, it seems EMGs are your thing. Awesome!

Active pickups seem to be your tone zone. I think EMGs are often under-appreciated as anything other than a heavy metal pickup. They're actually quite versatile.




I thought you just said you found your tone with the EMGs?

***bangs head on wall***

But, making your own is sure to be a fun opportunity to learn and explore, so more power to you.

I've contemplated doing the same thing to make my own mini-humbuckers, but I don't feel like spending the money for a good winding machine.

Maybe, instead of a "Von Herndon" Strat, you should do "Von Herndon" pickups!

That would be cool.




Presence on full? That does seem like a formula for allowing some spikiness through, depending on the guitar.

I do have a question. Are you adjusting your amp for each guitar, or just keeping the amp settings the same? I've found that I can't really expect to use different guitars without, sometimes, having to make some adjustments to the amp for that guitar. Think of it like this, when you plug your guitar into an amp, that guitar's components become part of the entire circuitry. The amp and guitar are not separate. They now are mated as one complete, electronic/audio system. In one sense, you are really "playing" the amp. Your guitar really becomes just a pitch controller. So, you likely have to manipulate the amp to achieve a desired tone with a given guitar, since you've now inserted different components into the circuit.

Another thing, when I'm setting up patches and sounds, I leave the effects out of the equation until I get the guitar/amp setup in the neighborhood. Then, I add the effects. I may still have to go back and tweak the amp after adding the effects, but I try to get just the guitar and amp as close as I can, first.

I do like your approach of using no distortion pedals and letting the amp gain do its thing. Sometimes, I'll add a Tubescreamer to provide a little extra push or girth, but I really prefer the amp's organic overdrive.

But, I'll go back to your obvious preference for EMGs. Those seem to be the only p'ups for which you've consistently expressed praise and satisfaction. Maybe, they're just your thing.
Click to expand...

I find it absolutely necessary to move amp settings for each instrument. The only time I left the settings the same was when comparing the guitars themselves...
 
ivan H said:
Hi Robert, if I may make a suggestion, turn down the treble a little, & the mids up. The treble control acts as a balance control between the high frequencies & the mid & low frequencies, regardless of where the mid & low controls are set. The signal from the tone stack is passed on to the next stage via the treble pots wiper, or variable connection. So you can turn the mids & lows up but if the treble is up high it is still passing a balance of mainly high frequencies. With Marshalls I've found I always have the mids up higher than the treble. Another thing I like is the presence on zero, or near to as it keeps the power amp nice & tight, but that's a personal taste thing. Hope this helps. Cheers
Click to expand...

I played a lot tonight....changed a lot of settings, rolled treble back to 1/2 and rolled some tone off on the guitar too...made a nicer tone for sure...

Now for some strange reason, my DSL40C is making a constant sound like air escaping from it...I suspect a pre amp tube.....

EMG...what I like is how quiet they are. I'm not a huge fan of their tone....I think they lack a little character????
 
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BGood said:
Maybe the Marshall is not the amp for that kind of sound ? I dunno, I don't own a Marshall.
Click to expand...

There's a lot of truth to that statement. Some guitars just won't do what you want in some amps, but sound stellar in others.

Robert,

Maybe, you don't need new pickups...maybe, you need a new AMP!

Yay! Amp-shopping time!

I suggest trying the Fender Supersonic, for starters.
 
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smitty_p said:
There's a lot of truth to that statement. Some guitars just won't do what you want in some amps, but sound stellar in others.

Robert,

Maybe, you don't need new pickups...maybe, you need a new AMP!

Yay! Amp-shopping time!

I suggest trying the Fender Supersonic, for starters.
Click to expand...

Well...I have no clue...still waiting on my vintage SG harness, then maybe experiment some more???
 
smitty_p said:
There's a lot of truth to that statement. Some guitars just won't do what you want in some amps, but sound stellar in others.

Robert,

Maybe, you don't need new pickups...maybe, you need a new AMP!

Yay! Amp-shopping time!

I suggest trying the Fender Supersonic, for starters.
Click to expand...

Smitty....you make a good point!!!!

Here is what I did last night...

I actually ran the guitar with the pickguard wired up, but upside down so I could wiggle everything around. I got a nasty buzz when I pinched the input jack "hot" lead (like it was bleeding through the insulation) so I added new, heavier input jack wiring and covered them both in shrink wrap. That eliminated the noise when touching the red wire. I also moved the position of the tone cap (an experiment) which was originally on one end of the tone pot...to the middle leg, according to a Seymour Duncan diagram, with no effect. The wire that joins the volume and tone pot made some noise if I touched it, so I shrink wrapped that wire too. I also lifted the shields on both pickups (experiment) and the noise remained. I then proceeded to swap on (3) different pickguards - A GFS H-S-S. Gibson 57's, GFS Fat Pats and 3 DiMarzio stacked single coils....and the crazy noise was still there.

Again, I was shocked to plug in my Gibson to the same exact rig and get no noise at all.

So now I am thinking, maybe it's an issue with the amplifier and the Gibson is quieter by virtue of its lower output pickups????

Strat Pickguards.jpg
 
ivan H said:
Hi Robert, if I may make a suggestion, turn down the treble a little, & the mids up. The treble control acts as a balance control between the high frequencies & the mid & low frequencies, regardless of where the mid & low controls are set. The signal from the tone stack is passed on to the next stage via the treble pots wiper, or variable connection. So you can turn the mids & lows up but if the treble is up high it is still passing a balance of mainly high frequencies. With Marshalls I've found I always have the mids up higher than the treble. Another thing I like is the presence on zero, or near to as it keeps the power amp nice & tight, but that's a personal taste thing. Hope this helps. Cheers
Click to expand...

I purposely kept the settings equal when doing all the guitar evaluation videos...normally, I use a GE-7 with bass a mids boosted, which gives more depth and dimension to the tone.

Once I get my recording studio completed, I can present a better tone...
 
smitty_p said:
There's a lot of truth to that statement. Some guitars just won't do what you want in some amps, but sound stellar in others.

Robert,

Maybe, you don't need new pickups...maybe, you need a new AMP!

Yay! Amp-shopping time!

I suggest trying the Fender Supersonic, for starters.
Click to expand...

Lost a preamp tube in my main DSL40C yesterday, so off to see the amp guy...I temporarily switched back to my ancient 1997 Marshall Valvestate VS265 2X12 Combo...IMG_20161124_40482.jpg
 
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