NCNCBS Day - Celestion Copperback 250

Amp Mad Scientist said:
EV used to have some neo speakers....I sort of lost track.
but I have to agree it's much more worthwhile to spend the extra money and buy good professional speakers.
The world is full of cheap junky speakers which are not worth the money that they cost; nor do they sound worth a crap either.
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Absolute truth that goes against xurrent speaker mythology.
 
Robert Herndon said:
Absolute truth that goes against xurrent speaker mythology.
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It's very surprising...
how much better a guitar sounds using a pro speaker.

And how many players don't realize how big of a difference it is.
Literally night and day difference.

If I modified a combo amp, the first thing I would do is change the speakers.
Huge improvement ----just by doing that one thing.
The amp is now twice as loud...
The amp no longer sounds like a stinker in a bathtub.

I can't believe how cheap the speakers are in stock amps.
Like a lot of Marshall / Fender amps.
The stock speakers in most combo amps are shameful....you might think that manufacturers had more pride in the products they build.

Then again good speakers cost a lot, although very well worth the money.
Stock speaker = $29
Good speaker = $200
Is the Good speaker 10X better? Yes.
 
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Amp Mad Scientist said:
It's very surprising...
how much better a guitar sounds using a pro speaker.


Then again good speakers cost a lot, although very well worth the money.
Stock speaker = $29
Good speaker = $200
Is the Good speaker 10X better? Yes.
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Amen. Surprising how many people chase pickups, pedals, amp heads, SIMS/IRs and never once think to replace their 2 lb cheap stock speaker made from recycled beer cans and coffee filters with a professional quality one.
 
"...without the signature cone break up immediately associated with the classic Celestion growl."

That line right there would stop me from buying them. Gives the impression these are for clean guitar players, not high gain players.
 
Iron1 said:
"...without the signature cone break up immediately associated with the classic Celestion growl."

That line right there would stop me from buying them. Gives the impression these are for clean guitar players, not high gain players.
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Exactly the opposite.

The cone break up that an overloaded Celestion puts out is actually an inefficient operating condition. I don't want to add "speaker clipping" to my tone. I want to hear everything the amp has to give without the speaker adding "distortion" to the mix.


My first pair of Celestion Creambacks lasted one (4) hour show and I blew the cones apart from the voice coil bellows.

They are also not guaranteed against any kind of failure like that. When inspected by Celestion, they said the speaker appeared to have received more than its rated wattage. The tech got silent when I told him I killed his 75 watt speaker with a 40 watt Marshall DSL40C.
 
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Robert Herndon said:
Exactly the opposite.

The cone break up that an overloaded Celestion puts out is actually an inefficient operating condition. I don't want to add "speaker clipping" to my tone. I want to hear everything the amp has to give without the speaker adding "distortion" to the mix.


My first pair of Celestion Creambacks lasted one (4) hour show and I blew the cones apart from the voice coil bellows.

They are also not guaranteed against any kind of failure like that. When inspected by Celestion, they said the speaker appeared to have received more than its rated wattage. The tech got silent when I told him I killed his 75 watt speaker with a 40 watt Marshall DSL40C.
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Speaker compression (saturation) is a characteristic of Celestion speakers with Marshall amplifiers...
To optimize this thin speaker wire should be used. (Thin wire sounds much better)
It sounds good, and limits the loudness of the amplifier. The speaker reaches a certain loudness and can't get any louder.

Ideally when playing the classic speakers, 2 stacks should be used alternately.
The first stack is used for no more than 45 minutes....
The second stack is then connected while the first one cools off.
Yes the little baby voice coils get very hot and can melt.
You will see this configuration on many stages...where the classic low watt Celestions are played.

The speaker should be rated at least 2X the power of the amplifier for reliability.
(that's the Dan Armstrong rule)

The other school of thought is the speaker that doesn't saturate. (like an EVM)
It's going to be much louder for one thing.

But both types have advantages and disadvantages.
Some people just like the sound of a saturated speaker, it's crunchy.
 
old rocker said:
Hi Robert, have you used/tried the Celestion Redback(150W) ?, if so how does it compare to the Copperback, ?.
I have a Redback in my HF modded ORI50C & it sounds really good, but the Amp weighs a bloody ton, far to heavy for an OAP :)
Cheers, Graham.

PS, just thought have you tried the Celestion V-Type ?
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Hey, Graham,

Here are the 12" speakers I tried and the results

Single speaker in 40 Watt DSL40C:

Celestion G1275H - blew cone off voice coil bellows

Twin Speakers in 2x12 Cabinet powered by 40 Watt DSL40C:

Pair of Celestion G12M 25 Watt -

blew cones off both voice coils

Response from Celestion Post-Inspection - "Speakers received excessive power."

(LOL Typical response trying to justify poop quality.)

WGS 50 Watt 55Hz Reaper in DSL40C

Subdued highs

Zero issues

Jensen Jet 100 Watt Stealth Neodymium

Great speaker with subdued low end

Zero Issues

Jensen 80 Watt Stealth Neodymium

Very well rounded speaker

Zero Issues

Electro-Harmonix 12VR75

Zero Issues - very pronounced midcrange

I did play through a pair of borrowed Celestion Goldbacks at one point, but I didn't dare push them.
 
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Never heard of these Copperbacks or a Marshall Neanderthal. So how are you liking them so far.

I just got my 1st UK Greenback & a Cannabis Rex for an extra set of new Jenson Nighthawk 75's I bought during the 2fer sale. I was using G12M-70's from an 80's Marshall cab (still have them). I just swapped the GB into the cab I am using for the Friedman and it's alive again. Sounds excellent so I think the set of Nighthawks are going. Gonna slap the Rex in the DSL cab and see how it likes it now.
 
Robert Herndon said:
Hey, Graham,

Here are the 12" speakers I tried and the results

Single speaker in 40 Watt DSL40C:

Celestion G1275H - blew cone off voice coil bellows

Twin Speakers in 2x12 Cabinet powered by 40 Watt DSL40C:

Pair of Celestion G12M 25 Watt -

blew cones off both voice coils

Response from Celestion Post-Inspection - "Speakers received excessive power."

(LOL Typical response trying to justify :poo: quality.)

WGS 50 Watt 55Hz Reaper in DSL40C

Subdued highs

Zero issues

Jensen Jet 100 Watt Stealth Neodymium

Great speaker with subdued low end

Zero Issues

Jensen 80 Watt Stealth Neodymium

Very well rounded speaker

Zero Issues

Electro-Harmonix 12VR75

Zero Issues - very pronounced midcrange

I did play through a pair of borrowed Celestion Goldbacks at one point, but I didn't dare push them.
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I was particularly interested in a comparison of the Copperback to a Redback, have you no experience with the Redback ?.
 
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