6CA7 in a Marshall DSL100HR. Worth Doing?

Cadorman

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I found this guy by me in St. Paul matching new tubes and selling vintage stuff. Anyone think I would see any advantage to going to a matched set of 6CA7's over the stock factory power tubes?
 
I found this guy by me in St. Paul matching new tubes and selling vintage stuff. Anyone think I would see any advantage to going to a matched set of 6CA7's over the stock factory power tubes?
Couldn't hurt to try. Do you run it up enough to really push the power section? Might not hear much diff otherwise.
 
Couldn't hurt to try. Do you run it up enough to really push the power section? Might not hear much diff otherwise.
Pretty much what I was thinking. The price is decent and the guy is local. I'm not running it loud enough generally to get any power tube break up, so if these have a little more headroom and are a bit darker sounding that would be fine.
 
I'm getting ready to head over to TC Tubes to check out the shop and pick up a set of 6CA7 tubes.
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I've already taken the DSL100HR out of the shell and checked the current values.
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I have plate voltages between 430.7 and 431.1 on all four. The left and right bias voltages are 80.2mv and 78.3mv, so just shy of 70 percent.
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This little board is the bottom of the bias pots and test points. You can turn the pots with your fingers on this amp and easily probe the voltage from the bottom. I will report more after I get the tubes.
 
Got the tubes. I didn't get inside the shop as they are being super careful. Probably for the best anyway with me having surgery in a week. Very nice couple (Tyler and Chelsea) specializing in stereo/guitar tube amp and turntable repairs.
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The Electro Harmonix 6CA7 set was nicely matched. My plate voltages were all within .4 volts and they biased up just fine. Plate voltages ended up right around 436.5 vdc.

I can't crank it up tonight since my wife is home, but I can tell it sounds better. I was having issues with some weird buzzing harmonics that I had been trying to dial out with my eq pedal and amp eq to no avail. It was like the harmonics were out of tune with each other and grating. Totally gone with the new tubes. The harmonics have a very nice kerrang now and I am very happy. I had an old set of EH EL34s in it before that came in a used amp. I had them in the 100 watt 900 and they were fine. I'll have to try them again.

If anyone wants to check out the shop the web address is www.tctubes.com
 
I found this guy by me in St. Paul matching new tubes and selling vintage stuff. Anyone think I would see any advantage to going to a matched set of 6CA7's over the stock factory power tubes?
The elctro harmonix 6CA7 is not a real 6CA7.
It's a relabeled tube, but who knows which tube it really is.
A real 6CA7 is a pentode.
The EH 6CA7 is a tetrode.
Just a heads up.

Electro-harmonix has been pulling a lot of substitutions and re-labeling of tubes....

Traynor Amps:
DO NOT plug an electro harmonix 6CA7 into a Traynor amp.
You will short out your bias power supply and damage the amp.
Just a word of warning.
 
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Got the tubes. I didn't get inside the shop as they are being super careful. Probably for the best anyway with me having surgery in a week. Very nice couple (Tyler and Chelsea) specializing in stereo/guitar tube amp and turntable repairs.
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The Electro Harmonix 6CA7 set was nicely matched. My plate voltages were all within .4 volts and they biased up just fine. Plate voltages ended up right around 436.5 vdc.

I can't crank it up tonight since my wife is home, but I can tell it sounds better. I was having issues with some weird buzzing harmonics that I had been trying to dial out with my eq pedal and amp eq to no avail. It was like the harmonics were out of tune with each other and grating. Totally gone with the new tubes. The harmonics have a very nice kerrang now and I am very happy. I had an old set of EH EL34s in it before that came in a used amp. I had them in the 100 watt 900 and they were fine. I'll have to try them again.

If anyone wants to check out the shop the web address is www.tctubes.com

I use 6CA7'S all the time. In a few Marshallz. I notice more articulation soloing over the 34's.

Usually use EH's. If you need a fatter tone grab JJ's version. Either are articulate when soloing.
 
The elctro harmonix 6CA7 is not a real 6CA7.
It's a relabeled tube, but who knows which tube it really is.
A real 6CA7 is a pentode.
The EH 6CA7 is a tetrode.
Just a heads up.

Electro-harmonix has been pulling a lot of substitutions and re-labeling of tubes....

Traynor Amps:
DO NOT plug an electro harmonix 6CA7 into a Traynor amp.
You will short out your bias power supply and damage the amp.
Just a word of warning.
There is a lot of confusion & missinformation regarding exactly what makes for a "true" 6CA7 (which, by the way, the EH 6CA7 actually "is"), especially among people who have never actually used old production USA made 6CA7's as designed by Sylvania.
So let's go back in time & get to the bottom of it shall we.
So, Philips (Mullard) designed & patented the pentode. A pentode has 5 electrodes, being a cathode, control grid, screen grid, suppressor grid & anode (aka plate). Anyone using this fabulous "pentode" design had to pay Philips a royalty.
The MO Valve company (MO = Marconi Osram) set about to design a new valve type to avoid paying royalties to Philips.
The design that they came up with did away with the "suppressor" grid. Rather, it used "beam forming plates" to focus the electron stream into a narrow "beam" that had the effect of greatly reducing secondary emission (electrons bouncing "back" off the plate), the very same thing that the suppressor grid was designed to do in a pentode.
The MO Valve company called this newly designed tube a "beam tetrode" & in an info sharing arrangement with US valve manufacturers, shared the technological design info.
The MO Valve company further used precise alignment of the control grid & screen grid wires & manipulated the plate structure of the "beam tetrode" to produce what is known as the "kinkless tetrode". The KT66, KT77, KT88 are among these (KT = kinkless tetrode). The MO Valve company DID NOT share this info with manufacturers in the USA.
Back to the 6CA7. Sylvania utilised the MO Valve companies "beam forming plates" technology to design & produce the 6CA7, seen here16186394118245089955221564650447.jpg
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Commonly known as a "fat bottle" or "fat boy" 6CA7.
To summarise, the pentode, which contains a suppressor grid, was patented. The "beam tetrode", which does not contain a suppressor grid, was designed to avoid paying "pentode" royalties. The "true" 6CA7 has beam forming plates & no suppressor grid, therefore is a "beam tetrode".
Now we see a lot of talk about the beam forming plates being "electrodes" inside the valve so it has to be a pentode, but I'm sure the design engineers at the MO Valve company who designed the freaking "beam tetrode" valve type knew maybe just a little more than these armchair valve commentators calling it a pentode,,, so I'll take the designers word on what it is.
The 6CA7 is an acceptable substitute for the EL34 in many applications, even though one is a beam tetrode while the other is a pentode, however it is not an acceptable substitute in some designs (where there is a negative voltage applied to the pentode's suppressor grid, for example).

No you can't plug the EH 6CA7 into your Traynor amp (unless it's first modified to allow it).
You also can't plug an original US made Sylvania, RCA or GE 6CA7 into your Traynor amp either, unless it's first modified to allow it.
You can plug a JJ 6CA7 into your Traynor amp though, as the JJ 6CA7 isn't a true 6CA7, rather, a "pentode" design. Cheers
 
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I had an early 60's era Aussie made amp that used a duet of 6CA7's to output about 40 watts, one of several amps I regret getting rid of. A "clean to mild breakup" type amp, the 6CA7's really suited the design. Still had the original Sylvania output tubes (& Miniwatt pre's & GE 5AR4 rectifier) when I sold it mid 80's.
A bit of trivia, Eddie Van Halen used Sylvania 6CA7's in his Plexi for the recording of VH1. Cheers
 
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