NGD - LP Copy

See once you leave that Gibson building and make um some where else all that Gibson Mojo is gone.Like Elvis has left the building only it would be Gibson in this case hahahah,hey its morning lol.More coffee
 
DonP said:
Good answer. I'm not so much interested in the legalities of this as the perception of the buyer - the perceived value for money. I'm reminded of the art world. Someone buys a Monet for 20 million, hangs it on e wall and looks at it every day, revering the colours, the brush strokes. Then an art expert examines it and declares it a fake. Suddenly it is not worth looking at any more and nobody will buy it. But it is still that same captivating painting. I guess what I'm saying is that all of this stuff is messy and complicated, and nothing is in black and white.
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True. LI guess that in life, everyone seeks different types of validate and has different ideas of beauty. If you truly appreciate beauty for the object itself, almost everything is beautiful and its derivation is meaningless. If you find beauty in status or exclusivity, things change quite a bit.

One reason I do not buy more costly guitars anymore is because they DO NOT need any work. That is not fun for me. Before, I wanted the "best" (according to others) and I suspect that is because I had much less confidence in my playing ability. In the end, I relish my journey and evolution as much as I sometimes cringe when recalling my former self, but they go hand in hand!
 
You do realize RVA that you have reached Luthier status wether you know it or not .Now if you worked on Flute and Obos and other Instruments youd be a Luthier. but with all the work you do on guitars you are anyway far as im concerned.I love working on guitars myself.fact one of my side buisnesses i do is guitar repairs and such.
 
JohnnyGoo said:
You do realize RVA that you have reached Luthier status wether you know it or not .Now if you worked on Flute and Obos and other Instruments youd be a Luthier. but with all the work you do on guitars you are anyway far as im concerned.I love working on guitars myself.fact one of my side buisnesses i do is guitar repairs and such.
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I very much appreciate the compliment Johnny. Thank you.
 
DonP said:
Good answer. I'm not so much interested in the legalities of this as the perception of the buyer - the perceived value for money. I'm reminded of the art world. Someone buys a Monet for 20 million, hangs it on e wall and looks at it every day, revering the colours, the brush strokes. Then an art expert examines it and declares it a fake. Suddenly it is not worth looking at any more and nobody will buy it. But it is still that same captivating painting. I guess what I'm saying is that all of this stuff is messy and complicated, and nothing is in black and white.
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We can take it from the other direction...suppose Gibson contracts another company to ghost build a guitar. It is not made by Gibson employees, using Gibson materials, nor under Gibson's roof. But, it bears Gibson's name and has Gibson's serial number and documentation.

Is it a Gibson?

In Don's first example, the people, materials, and location are all Gibson's, but the guitar lacks Gibson's official sanction.

In my example, none of the employees, materials, and location are Gibson's, but the guitar does have Gibson's official sanction.

Legally, they are Gibsons. But, I dare say the perception would be that they lack some authenticity.
 
smitty_p said:
We can take it from the other direction...suppose Gibson contracts another company to ghost build a guitar. It is not made by Gibson employees, using Gibson materials, nor under Gibson's roof. But, it bears Gibson's name and has Gibson's serial number and documentation.

Is it a Gibson?

In Don's first example, the people, materials, and location are all Gibson's, but the guitar lacks Gibson's official sanction.

In my example, none of the employees, materials, and location are Gibson's, but the guitar does have Gibson's official sanction.

Legally, they are Gibsons. But, I dare say the perception would be that they lack some authenticity.
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I think it is still a Gibson. Sadly, no manufacturer, including Gibson, has to follow a magic recipe to make it their product. Gibson is a manufacturer, not a guitar. Now, if you asked me how far a Les Paul could vary from its original design and still be a Les Paul, that would be another argument, possibly a lengthy one with no real answer. But a Gibson is a Gibson because Gibson says it is a Gibson.

Funny, I have thought it interesting when a sports fan says "I have been a xxxinsert team namexxxx fan for 30 years. Yet the players have completely changed 3x over. Is it the same team? I guess, because you are a fan of the organization. becoming a fan of a player is a separate thing.
 
RVA said:
I think it is still a Gibson. Sadly, no manufacturer, including Gibson, has to follow a magic receipt to make it their product. Gibson is a manufacturer, not a guitar. Now, if you asked me how far a Les Paul could vary from its original design and still be a Les Paul, that would be another argument, possibly a lengthy one with no real answer. But a Gibson is a Gibson because Gibson says it is a Gibson.

Funny, I have thought it interesting when a sports fan says "I have been a xxxinsert team namexxxx fan for 30 years. Yet the players have completely changed 3x over. Is it the same team? I guess, because you are a fan of the organization. becoming a fan of a player is a separate thing.
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I've seen that and I don't like it. It is "flag" mentality which is both stupid and dangerous.
 
DonP said:
Here's something to ponder. Suppose the workers in the Gibson factory stayed late one night and produced Les Pauls unofficially - didn't appear on the books and got sold on the black market. Would those be fakes?
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Well my Chibson came with Epi spec metals....and EPIPHONE pickups.....so.....its VERY possible.....the plant it came from is now or USED to produce for Epiphone and they run some off with the Gibbo headstock shape and some with the Epi shape.......wink wink nudge nudge .... "The Man" knows about the Epis not the Gibbos that go out the back door.....just sayin....
 
Hackmaster said:
That thing is truly a thing a beauty.
These Chibi's keep going up in build quality, but they just can't seem to fathom competent wiring.
But when they get it right, these will be hard to pass up.
Hell I want one now... Just for academic purposes of course, to mod & route till the cows come home.
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They should just install all the old take-out Gibson PCB's and quick connects...there's plenty of them out there!
 
DonP said:
It's also a half a hundredweight of mahogany thing.
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It's not the wood per se, IMHO, but the rigidity of the construction and its resonant qualities. If this were not true, simply putting a Gibson humbucker in a Stratocaster would make it sound like a Les Paul, and this has been done and does not produce that tone...
 
Robert Herndon said:
It's not the wood per se, IMHO, but the rigidity of the construction and its resonant qualities. If this were not true, simply putting a Gibson humbucker in a Stratocaster would make it sound like a Les Paul, and this has been done and does not produce that tone...
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Not the wood - the solid mass makes the whole guitar much stiffer.
 
Robert Herndon said:
It's not the wood per se, IMHO, but the rigidity of the construction and its resonant qualities. If this were not true, simply putting a Gibson humbucker in a Stratocaster would make it sound like a Les Paul, and this has been done and does not produce that tone...
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Pickup placement comes in to play too...distance from the bridge affects tone.
 
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Robert Herndon said:
They should just install all the old take-out Gibson PCB's and quick connects...there's plenty of them out there!
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I don't have a problem with the PCB - if the guitar still sounds ok then that's fine by me. I like not having to solder if I change pickups to another Gibson pickup.

&, yes, as JG says, RVA has become very good at this woodwork and metalwork stuff.
 
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