Gibson Neck Angles:

Come by the GC in Lakeland......you'll be SHOCKED and amazed.......rusted strings (on new guitars) soda spilled all over used guitars ......lose switches.....filth and schmutz......--Pedals that spark and ground out when you try and test them---- amps that dont work----but they ask TOP dollar---and refuse to "deal" -----OH and the OTHER trick is the "police hold" on all used gear--- stuff hangs on the wall--- you play it---you like it--- but WAIT! you cant take it----- because they took it on trade and its on "police hold" for 30 days .......you can buy it and come back in 30 days.........WTF? why dont they leave it in the back---- like a PROPER PAWN SHOP --- till its sellable?????

I know why---- but their attempts at Ferengi ways are sad and insulting-----I have had zero luck with that place.....Offered them a fair price on a nasty dirty rusted Peavey Ultra Bass a few months back --- the bass was actually STICKY --- the knobs where lose.....but --- it was worth 250......not 375.00 they had on it.......they wouldnt come down on the price and would show any interest in a Telecaster Trade (offered me 70.00 store credit on a Dual humbucker Squire Telecaster Deluxe) a 400.00 new guitar---- 70.00---- idiots---- I left went home and got online score a neck through Peavey Unity bass in EXCELLENT clean condition with HSC delivered to my door for 240.00 .........GC can bite me. rant ---over---
 
Robert Herndon said:
In total agreement, Smitty...

I guess, if you consider the nearly 1/2" of Faber shims under my SG tailpiece, as long as the strings clear the bridge, it's ok, but I had to use longer tailpiece studs too because I was running out of thread and the tailpiece was tilted towards the bridge.

It just really bugs me to see things out of whack when the manufacturers tolerance is so precise... 5 degrees +\- 15 seconds...it makes me doubt everything about the instrument.

Then, I look at my Les Paul Custom 'R'...tailpiece on the body, bridge has only two threads exposed and action is in the .050's on the bass side and .030's on the treble side.

The Les Paul Custom 'R' reminded me of a time when guitars were fun to play. This thing has been pure enjoyment. From watching its build progress, to the first strum, just an absolute pleasure...everywhere I check intonation, its in and when I play it, there is a feeling of sonic freedom...a confidence if you will, that surfaces in my playing.

I'm not the best guitarist. I'm quite musically illiterate, but when a guitar sounds right... is in pitch, has a nice, thick tone, good sustain and rich, stinging harmonics, I find myself playing a little more aggressively....a little more fluidly....

Its certainly not a perfect guitar, but it is well balanced in every regard....

View attachment 4300

View attachment 4301

View attachment 4302
Click to expand...

Are these last 2 pics both your guitar as in the same guitar?? No, I see now, one has pup surrounds & the other doesn't.

upload_2017-4-26_18-51-39.png

Just how high is the action? Is there enough neck relief or are you trying to play on a straight fretboard?

Same questions for this one..

upload_2017-4-26_18-55-35.png

That is the highest I've ever seen a Gibson! Not right.

Both of these guitars are perfect candidates for top wrapping their stop tail pieces! If not sent back. I would not have kept a guitar that had this stop tail & bridge height after proper neck relief truss rod adjustments. It is not good enough for anything with a Gibson name on it!!


Robert Herndon said:
I think, with Epiphones in particular, their more consistent quality is due to more CNC operations and less drunk/pissed off/unskilled laborers..
Click to expand...

That's a cheap shot bro. Did you write that after consuming some Scotch er what?
 
Relic said:
Are these last 2 pics both your guitar as in the same guitar?? No, I see now, one has pup surrounds & the other doesn't.

View attachment 4374

Just how high is the action? Is there enough neck relief or are you trying to play on a straight fretboard?

Same questions for this one..

View attachment 4375

That is the highest I've ever seen a Gibson! Not right.

Both of these guitars are perfect candidates for top wrapping their stop tail pieces! If not sent back. I would not have kept a guitar that had this stop tail & bridge height after proper neck relief truss rod adjustments. It is not good enough for anything with a Gibson name on it!!




That's a cheap shot bro. Did you write that after consuming some Scotch er what?
Click to expand...

Cheap shot or blatant fact, however you want to look at it.

And you must not see many Gibsons. Half of them at Guitar sinner are set that high and one Les Paul Custom still has the strings on the bridge even with an elevated tailpiece.

And you are absolutely right. I should have sent the SG back....just like I did with my brand new 2003 Gibson SG Standard in 2004.

Live and learn...

Ok...the pic without surrounds is my 2016 Gibson SG. The relief is good (.011") and the action is .045" bass and .039" treble.

Now, because of the neck angle, I used the Faber shims to get the strings off the bridge and what you see is what it took to accomplish that. Yes you can top wrap. Either way the neck angle is off. Typical of Gibson.

The black guitar is my Les Paul custom. Relief is .010" the tailpiece is locked down, strings clear the bridge by a mile, action is .040" bass and .035" treble.
 
Robert Herndon said:
And you must not see many Gibsons. Half of them at Guitar sinner are set that high and one Les Paul Custom still has the strings on the bridge even with an elevated tailpiece.
Click to expand...

Ummm...I think I better step in just for a second before the fur really flies!

Yes, Robert, Relic has seen many Gibsons. I first became acquainted with him on the other forum. The number of Gibsons he's owned over the years dwarfs my entire guitar collection, which currently stands at seven electrics and two acoustics. He's also had a collection of amps over the years that anyone would envy. When he talks about the sound of this or that amplifier, it's because he can just plug into it and listen.

And he is a perfectionist who gigs regularly. He knows what his gear needs to do.

He's had Les Pauls, SGs, ES-335s, Flying Vs, Explorers, and even an M III.

He's also not a mindless Gibson apologist. He'll openly call out anything he doesn't like about Gibson.

Sooooo...I just figured I'd toss that out there for consideration.

I think I'm gonna go hide now!
 
eSGEe said:
Come by the GC in Lakeland......you'll be SHOCKED and amazed.......rusted strings (on new guitars) soda spilled all over used guitars ......lose switches.....filth and schmutz......--Pedals that spark and ground out when you try and test them---- amps that dont work----but they ask TOP dollar---and refuse to "deal" -----OH and the OTHER trick is the "police hold" on all used gear--- stuff hangs on the wall--- you play it---you like it--- but WAIT! you cant take it----- because they took it on trade and its on "police hold" for 30 days .......you can buy it and come back in 30 days.........WTF? why dont they leave it in the back---- like a PROPER PAWN SHOP --- till its sellable?????

I know why---- but their attempts at Ferengi ways are sad and insulting-----I have had zero luck with that place.....Offered them a fair price on a nasty dirty rusted Peavey Ultra Bass a few months back --- the bass was actually STICKY --- the knobs where lose.....but --- it was worth 250......not 375.00 they had on it.......they wouldnt come down on the price and would show any interest in a Telecaster Trade (offered me 70.00 store credit on a Dual humbucker Squire Telecaster Deluxe) a 400.00 new guitar---- 70.00---- idiots---- I left went home and got online score a neck through Peavey Unity bass in EXCELLENT clean condition with HSC delivered to my door for 240.00 .........GC can bite me. rant ---over---
Click to expand...

Sounds to me like it's time for a face to face with the store manager & you can ask him for answers to these dumbfounding questions. Simply confront him with the stores stupidity & sloth & sincerely ask him for a 'why' explanation for all the garbage & nonsense you as a customer see ..
"rusted strings (on new guitars)
soda spilled all over used guitars ......
lose switches.....
filth and schmutz......--
Pedals that spark and ground out when you try and test them----
amps that dont work----
but they ask TOP dollar---and refuse to "deal" -----
OH and the OTHER trick is the "police hold" on all used gear--- stuff hangs on the wall--- you play it---you like it--- but WAIT! you cant take it----- because they took it on trade and its on "police hold" for 30 days .......you can buy it and come back in 30 days.........WTF?

And if & when you don't get satisfaction simply shame him & insult him for running the most fuct up store you've ever tried to work with. Then let him know you were a plant from headquarters & that the home office will be getting a full report!

Then drop mic & leave calmly & smugly with the knowledge that his little wheels are spinning in that sludge filled mind of his right now.

Better yet, calmly record this interaction & his response. You know there are no good answers for what is going on. Then put his $#it in the wind.
 
smitty_p said:
Ummm...I think I better step in just for a second before the fur really flies!

Yes, Robert, Relic has seen many Gibsons. I first became acquainted with him on the other forum. The number of Gibsons he's owned over the years dwarfs my entire guitar collection, which currently stands at seven electrics and two acoustics. He also has a collection of amps that anyone would envy. When he talks about the sound of this or that amplifier, it's because he can just plug into it and listen.

He's had Les Pauls, SGs, ES-335s, Flying Vs, Explorers, and even an M III.

He's also not a mindless Gibson apologist. He'll openly call out anything he doesn't like about Gibson.

Sooooo...I just figured I'd toss that out there for consideration.

I think I'm gonna go hide now!
Click to expand...

Hey Smitty...

Cool man. It's all good. I just tell you what I see and the evidence is there, so maybe Relic is lucky and has alwsys had goid Gibson's. I hope that's the case because I wouldn't wish my two brand new junk Gibson's, 14 years apart, on anyone.

I just can't stand the "anything Gibson shits out is acceptable" mantra.
 
Robert Herndon said:
Hey Smitty...

Cool man. It's all good. I just tell you what I see and the evidence is there, so maybe Relic is lucky and has alwsys had goid Gibson's. I hope that's the case because I wouldn't wish my two brand new junk Gibson's, 14 years apart, on anyone.

I just can't stand the "anything Gibson shits out is acceptable" mantra.
Click to expand...

Don't take my words the wrong way. I'm not upset. And, I'm not trying to give you a dressing down. I was actually smiling as I typed my above post. Maybe it came off as rude and blunt...that wasn't my intention.

My apologies.
 
smitty_p said:
Don't take my words the wrong way. I'm not upset. And, I'm not trying to give you a dressing down. I was actually smiling as I typed my above post. Maybe it came off as rude and blunt...that wasn't my intention.

My apologies.
Click to expand...

Dude,

I like every body. I have no beef with any human being. I may have issues with a builders quality control, but that's a separate issue.

I'm sure Relic is a cool dude too.

Yes. This entire 2016 Gibson SG fiasco really pissed me off. But I also learned that I encountered the same problems so many others were having with Gibsons in general.

In the end, and out of sheer stubbornness, I fixed the problems (other than neck angle) with my SG and its now a great playing guitar. My students play it and they really love being able to plug a real Gibson into a tube Marshall for their lessons.
 
Robert Herndon said:
Hey Smitty...

Cool man. It's all good. I just tell you what I see and the evidence is there, so maybe Relic is lucky and has alwsys had goid Gibson's. I hope that's the case because I wouldn't wish my two brand new junk Gibson's, 14 years apart, on anyone.

I just can't stand the "anything Gibson shits out is acceptable" mantra.
Click to expand...
smitty_p said:
Don't take my words the wrong way. I'm not upset. And, I'm not trying to give you a dressing down. I was actually smiling as I typed my above post. Maybe it came off as rude and blunt...that wasn't my intention.

My apologies.
Click to expand...


Nah, we're all good folks. We're big boys.

Roberts problem seems to be the lack of qualified guitar personnel working in the guitar department & doing set ups! A legit neck angle like displayed in that picture is simply unacceptable & 1, shouldn't have made the display floor. 2, shouldn't have left the store! & 3, should have been returned to Gibson & a refund or replacement!!!

I have sent 2 Gibsons back myself & am certainly not to be thought of as a Gibson apologist.

I'm very picky & particular about a guitar I intend to play. More accepting & forgiving of flaws on vintage gear I like & intend to collect as a hobby I enjoy.

I pull no punches & because of that I have been on the receiving end of Biddlins Gibson wrath myself.
In the end, things are what they are.
We not only have the free will & right to talk about these problems & flaws, but a forum like this is the ideal place to have these conversations!

So the admonishing of Gibson 'complainers' who find problems & fault with Gibson guitars is simply lost on me.
 
wheres-the-beef1.jpg
 
Robert Herndon said:
Probably why the guys I see doing studio work all the time almost all play a Luke or PRS.
Click to expand...

One of my best playing, best sounding & most reliable guitar with a tremolo with stable tuning is a PRS Santana SE that I put vintage Gibson Patent number sticker pups in!

PRS Santana SE with 60'sGibson Patent Sticker PUPs (2) (174x390).jpg

Why Gibson no longer makes a reasonably priced reliable guitar with a serious use tremolo is simply beyond me! They simply are screwing themselves out of a huge piece of the guitar market! The closest thing they have is a $4,000+ Les Paul with a Floyd!

upload_2017-4-26_20-1-36.png

upload_2017-4-26_20-6-34.png

Next cheapest?

upload_2017-4-26_20-8-32.pngupload_2017-4-26_19-59-43.png


Maybe an SG with a Vibrola?

upload_2017-4-26_20-4-34.png

So out of the 200 something Gibson guitars I just looked at at Sweetwater.com these were the cheapest options for a Gibson with a Tremolo !? WTF Gibson!? C'mon!

Doesn't this feel intentionally delinquent on Gibsons part?
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top