A Tale Of two Gibson's - DSL40C Isolation Booth Soundcheck:

[Inspector #20]

Ok,

So, in my home studio, I never mike my guitars. I record everything direct out through my Blackstar. Today, I had an empty nest and I was able to do some higher volume recording and though it might be fun to compare my Gibson S-G and Gibson Les Paul from a tonal perspective.

The Marshall DSL40C was put in an isolation room (extra bedroom) and mic'd from 4 Feet Away at a 45° Angle with Cardioid/Condensor Microphone.

Now, this is not intended to be the right way to do it, even the vocal mike is incorrect for this application, but this was just an experiment - without any changes to the amp settings - to hear the differences between my S-G and Les Paul.

Amp Dial (not clock) Settings: Lead 2 ON - Gain 3 - Volume 5 - Treble 8 - Mids 10 - Bass 7 - Tone Shift IN - Presence 3 - Resonance 5 - Reverb 2

First up is the Gibson S-G followed by the Gibson Les Paul. I play two separate phrases once with each guitar and pasted them back-to-back on the same track. No effort was made to lay down a really solid or precise track, just a consistent one. You'll have to cringe at the technical erros in these tracks.

Which do you prefer and why???

Gibson S-G Vs. Gibson Les Paul

 

[Hackmaster]

The first one sounds great, until you hit the second one.
The second one had more hair, more presence, more body & volume.
Quite possibly due to pickup differences between the SG & the Paul.

 

[smitty_p]

Ok,

So, in my home studio, I never mike my guitars. I record everything direct out through my Blackstar. Today, I had an empty nest and I was able to do some higher volume recording and though it might be fun to compare my Gibson S-G and Gibson Les Paul from a tonal perspective.

The Marshall DSL40C was put in an isolation room (extra bedroom) and mic'd from 4 Feet Away at a 45° Angle with Cardioid/Condensor Microphone.

Now, this is not intended to be the right way to do it, even the vocal mike is incorrect for this application, but this was just an experiment - without any changes to the amp settings - to hear the differences between my S-G and Les Paul.

Amp Dial (not clock) Settings: Lead 2 ON - Gain 3 - Volume 5 - Treble 8 - Mids 10 - Bass 7 - Tone Shift IN - Presence 3 - Resonance 5 - Reverb 2

First up is the Gibson S-G followed by the Gibson Les Paul. I play two separate phrases once with each guitar and pasted them back-to-back on the same track. No effort was made to lay down a really solid or precise track, just a consistent one. You'll have to cringe at the technical erros in these tracks.

Which do you prefer and why???

Gibson S-G Vs. Gibson Les Paul

I'm hearing room reflections being picked up by the mic, so it is a little difficult to evaluate the tonalities of the instruments, themselves. The reflections make the nuances less distinct.

I can definitely hear that the Les Paul is louder. I know what the SG should sound like. I have 57 Classics (currently with A2 magnets, though that may change soon) in mine, as well. I also have the 498T/490R combo in my Les Paul, so I'm familiar with that neighborhood of sound, too.

In the context of the recording, itself, I'd say I prefer the sound of the Les Paul. Though, if the SG was less masked by the reflections and was a little louder, I may prefer it's slightly smoother texture.

 

[Inspector #20]

The first one sounds great, until you hit the second one.
The second one had more hair, more presence, more body & volume.
Quite possibly due to pickup differences between the SG & the Paul.

First - S-G with 57 Classic Plus 9.4kΩ

Next - LP with 489T 15.2kΩ

Both guitars .009" X .046"

Both Pickups at 4/32" Height

Volume/Tones Full-Up on Both

 

[smitty_p]

First - S-G with 57 Classic Plus 9.4kΩ

Next - LP with 489T 15.2kΩ

Both guitars .009" X .046"

Both Pickups at 4/32" Height

Volume/Tones Full-Up on Both

Because the 57 Classics have weaker magnets, you may be able to get away with raising them closer to the strings without worrying about the magnetic pull on the strings.

 

[Inspector #20]

I'm hearing room reflections being picked up by the mic, so it is a little difficult to evaluate the tonalities of the instruments, themselves. The reflections make the nuances less distinct.

I can definitely hear that the Les Paul is louder. I know what the SG should sound like. I have 57 Classics (currently with A2 magnets, though that may change soon) in mine, as well. I also have the 498T/490R combo in my Les Paul, so I'm familiar with that neighborhood of sound, too.

In the context of the recording, itself, I'd say I prefer the sound of the Les Paul. Though, if the SG was less masked the reflections and was a little louder, I may prefer it's slightly smoother texture.

Yes!!!! Empty Room - Hardwood floors!!!! But, it was my only chance to make such an experiment at that volume level. I had the mike gain almost off!!!!!

That's the Reaper 55Hz with JJ-ECC83-MG (V1) JJ-5751 (V2) - JJ-ECC83S (V3) and 7025-WA (V4) with Electro harmonix EL-34 Power Tubes on the 40 watt (Full Power) setting.

 

[Inspector #20]

Because the 57 Classics have weaker magnets, you may be able to get away with raising them closer to the strings without worrying about the magnetic pull on the strings.

4/32" (fretted at the last fret) is where I set all my humbuckers and it's pretty dog-gone close!!!! By the way, no pull on the 498T even with much more output.

 

[smitty_p]

4/32" (fretted at the last fret) is where I set all my humbuckers and it's pretty dog-gone close!!!! By the way, no pull on the 498T even with much more output.

Have you tried raising the 57's closer...just to see what happens?

 

[Inspector #20]

here's the 1987 Squire with the Gibson 500T - same amp settings as above.

Phrase 1 (sammay hagar) Bridge Only

Phrase 2 (sammy hagar) 180° Out

Second Section

Phrase 1 (AC/DC) Bridge

1987 Squirecaster Gibson 500T In and Out Of Phase Soundclips

 

[ChasFred]

Gotta say I like the SG better than the Paul

 

[Inspector #20]

Gotta say I like the SG better than the Paul

Some like the "less gain" tone of the S-G. I'm playing the Les Paul almost all the time now because it just has that little something extra....

Have you heard the Les Paul here??? Bridge pickup only (498T) with these amp settings:




(this is the fugly flat-black Les Paul you played when we met up)


Faithfully (Instrumental)

 

[Inspector #20]

I should add that the ONLY modification to the 2016 Gibson Les Paul is the Faber 1959 Aluminum Tailpiece. That's it. No shielding...Nada...Zip...noisy as Hell!!!!

 

[BlackSG91]

To be honest I can't really hear any big difference and I think this is all subjective. If you tell someone that you have a new pick up in your guitar they will hear the difference. Trying to analyse your tone takes the fun and mystery out of playing music. And adding an aluminum tailpiece isn't going to make any real difference at all. You just end up spending extra money on your guitar thinking you'll magically improve your tone or sound, etc. At the end of it when performing in front of an audience is the crowd going to say hey that aluminum tailpiece really made the song sound better or will they ask you what your pick up height adjustments are. That's all thrown out the window when you perform live on stage. Remember...most of the tone is in your fingers.


;>)/

 

[Inspector #20]

To be honest I can't really hear any big difference and I think this is all subjective. If you tell someone that you have a new pick up in your guitar they will hear the difference. Trying to analyse your tone takes the fun and mystery out of playing music. And adding an aluminum tailpiece isn't going to make any real difference at all. You just end up spending extra money on your guitar thinking you'll magically improve your tone or sound, etc. At the end of it when performing in front of an audience is the crowd going to say hey that aluminum tailpiece really made the song sound better or will they ask you what your pick up height adjustments are. That's all thrown out the window when you perform live on stage. Remember...most of the tone is in your fingers.


;>)/

The tailpiece was a gift, so I needed to use it...

The Les Paul sounds 10 times 'bigger' than the S-G but both sound good to me..but when I want to intimidate other bands, I take the Les Paul...it's got a mean sound...and it's hideously ugly too...

 

[BlackSG91]

It sure is a nice guitar though...I'm glad you enjoy it.


;>)/

 

[Inspector #20]

The first one sounds great, until you hit the second one.
The second one had more hair, more presence, more body & volume.
Quite possibly due to pickup differences between the SG & the Paul.

Exactly how I felt when I listened!!!!!! TONE BROTHER!!!

 

[Inspector #20]

Because the 57 Classics have weaker magnets, you may be able to get away with raising them closer to the strings without worrying about the magnetic pull on the strings.

Could be!!!!! 4/32" (0.125") is pretty close!!!!

Here's the specs from an old Gibson sheet for the PAF's

Bridge pickup

Low E: 0.125"

Hi E : / 0.100"

Neck Pickup:

Low E: 0.140"

Hi E : 0.090"

4/32" seems to have the best overall tone and clarity without going spikey...at least on these guitars. All of mine set up just alike, even when setting strictly by ear...

 

[Inspector #20]

I'm hearing room reflections being picked up by the mic, so it is a little difficult to evaluate the tonalities of the instruments, themselves. The reflections make the nuances less distinct.

I can definitely hear that the Les Paul is louder. I know what the SG should sound like. I have 57 Classics (currently with A2 magnets, though that may change soon) in mine, as well. I also have the 498T/490R combo in my Les Paul, so I'm familiar with that neighborhood of sound, too.

In the context of the recording, itself, I'd say I prefer the sound of the Les Paul. Though, if the SG was less masked by the reflections and was a little louder, I may prefer it's slightly smoother texture.

Terrible acoustics!!!!

Here's the sonic crime scene!!!!!

Microphone and placement relative to the amp is exactly as used in these soundfiles posted above. The DSL40C was placed atop the Marshall VS265 - in place of the Blackstar....

 

[Thatbastarddon]

Terrible acoustics!!!!

Here's the sonic crime scene!!!!!

Microphone and placement relative to the amp is exactly as used in these soundfiles posted above. The DSL40C was placed atop the Marshall VS265 - in place of the Blackstar....

View attachment 21004

So..... what mic is that?... and why is it recording the corner of the room?...and is there a breeze from that corner that necessitated the pop filter/wind screen? Sooo many questions...going to listen now...

 

[Thatbastarddon]

Sounds just like the corner of a music room should!(to be clear, I’m kidding around a bit)
Nice playing Robert. But Smitty has a point; room reflection is pretty present. I know that loud amps can be tough to deal with...especially with sensitive condenser mic’s. The zero on the preamp knob is not a shameful place to approach. If the mic can handle the sound pressure and doesn’t need any gain, then so be it. Some preamps have pads built in for these scenarios (unfortunately your scarlet does not...but neither does my USB mixer, or my usb Dual pre). There are other routes as well...I have some in-line 12db, and some in-line 24db pads I picked up somewhere along the way. They work in a pinch for the right mic, on a heavy hitter.
Mine are not these, but the same idea...I don’t know if the guy that made mine is still doing them.
RapcoHorizon BLOX Series Inline Pad - -20dB