This is great to see

Great ..let the internal lawsuits commence.

New company quotes:

"I don't have to do that job because I own the company just as much as you do."

"How do I sell my portion and GTF out of here?"

Employee theft:
"I'm no longer really stealing the company property because technically I own it now."

"What do you mean I'M FIRED?? YOU'RE FIRED!!"

"I'll be taking the whole summer off ..by the way."
 
i-dont-understand-any-of-this-gregory-dillard.gif
:D
 
I use Bob’s Red Mil products my Doctor had me quit using wheat due to ingesting Round UP that they spray on the crops
before harvest kills the crops and saves the cutting blades
 
I work for an ESOP company. Sounds great? It has it's perks, but has a lot of downsides. If I knew what I know now, I wouldn't let the allure of an ESOP to skew my decision to take the job.

Nice that the owner is not selling out to a big corporation, so there's that.
 
iblive said:
KA is pretty much all we buy. I do buy inexpensive for feeding the sourdough though.
Click to expand...
Whenever I work near White River Junction, Vermont I make it a point to go to the King Arthur bakery school, restauraunt, and gift shop. I will stock up on stuff because it's far less expensive at the source, and you find many things that aren't at your average grocery store. Besides, their bakery/restauraunt is amazing and worth the stop. I get a lot of great baked goods to go.

I haven't bought bread at a grocery store in a year. I bake it every week with organic flour. I've been getting better and expanded beyond peasant's bread, and am trying different spelt and rye breads. Ocassionally I will buy some from places that use organics, or I'll get some of the imported breads from my local German market. But that is not very often.
 
Here's my current ESOP experience:

I was hired on, back in June. Sold on the ESOP that it was the "way to go" for making real retirement money and it was much better than a 401k. Since I've never dealt with one before I had a hard time coming up with questions about how it works and how it affected my income. It was explained to me that it was like a 401k but better because the company stock price is valued privately, and since the company was constantly growing, the company stock price has always risen, anywhere from 12% up to 35% per year, with an average of 18% growth rate. That's pretty solid investment numbers. In truth my company's stock eval went up massively this year.

Reality hit this January. We were revalued and everyone in the company was hailing the ESOP program and how much they were making now, and relishing in the returns. I checked my portfolio and saw NO CHANGE. So I started diving into it more. First thing is that any money the company gives up for your ESOP program such as 401k match, profit sharing, etc. goes into a low yield, low risk money market account to be held until the purchase of ESOP stocks.

1. ESOP stocks are purchased once per year in April. The company stock is a fixed quantity. There are only so many shares to go around. So, the only way to get stock is if someone else in the company sells theirs. No one can explain who gets precedent on the available shares. Since there are a fixed amount of stocks with a massive 1000+ employee company, what happens when there's not enough Stocks available to fulfill everyone's purchase in April.

2. ESOP stocks are purchased in April. The evaluation of the stock price change is in January. "The stock price has always risen." So, the price goes up and then you're allocated your stocks a few months later. Higher price means, less purchase power.

3. You cannot sell or trade your stocks with other members. The stocks are sold only after your employment ends. So you either have to retire, or quit/fired to get your ESOP stock money. They are only traded IN APRIL. If you get fired or quit in May, you have to wait until the following April to get your money from the ESOP program. But there's a catch, see #4.

4. When cashing out the ESOP, you only get a portion of the value per year. Your shares are sold over the period of 5 years and you are paid in May for each transaction. You can still accrue ESOP value through the stock evaluation changes and participate in the dividends and profit sharing but those go back into your ESOP account.

5. All bonuses, 401k matches, dividends, profit sharing go to the ESOP stock purchases. There's no election to take some cash in the meantime so you're stuck with the ESOP stocks.

6. Unlike a 401k, you do not have access to your ESOP money. If you need money desperately enough, you can cash out all or a portion of your 401k and depending on the type, pay a penalty but you can get money in a few days time. I used this option several times to pay for my kids college. With the ESOP program you cannot cash out any of the ESOP, but you apply for a loan from the company for the money you need, at an interest rate that is slightly higher than the 401k penalty rate.

In truth, the ESOP for retirement, if you plan on sticking around until that day, is a solid way to invest because, at least in my current company, the stock always goes up at a higher rate than most low-risk investments. However, since it's a stock price, the company is still hyper-focused on that metric. Everything is about raising the evaluation of the stock price, exactly like a publicly traded company. They are beholden to the private firms that evaluate the stock price, which is essentially, a made up number since it's not derived from the trading of said stock.
 
SG John said:
Whenever I work near White River Junction, Vermont I make it a point to go to the King Arthur bakery school, restauraunt, and gift shop. I will stock up on stuff because it's far less expensive at the source, and you find many things that aren't at your average grocery store. Besides, their bakery/restauraunt is amazing and worth the stop. I get a lot of great baked goods to go.

I haven't bought bread at a grocery store in a year. I bake it every week with organic flour. I've been getting better and expanded beyond peasant's bread, and am trying different spelt and rye breads. Ocassionally I will buy some from places that use organics, or I'll get some of the imported breads from my local German market. But that is not very often.
Click to expand...
Over the years we've attempted making "sandwich" bread and have just never been impressed. We do make bread like crunchy Italian or similar. Pizza crust for sure. Almost never do a carry out pizza anymore. Ours is just better than almost anything we've had from any of our local pizza joints.
 
Ghostman said:
Here's my current ESOP experience:

I was hired on, back in June. Sold on the ESOP that it was the "way to go" for making real retirement money and it was much better than a 401k. Since I've never dealt with one before I had a hard time coming up with questions about how it works and how it affected my income. It was explained to me that it was like a 401k but better because the company stock price is valued privately, and since the company was constantly growing, the company stock price has always risen, anywhere from 12% up to 35% per year, with an average of 18% growth rate. That's pretty solid investment numbers. In truth my company's stock eval went up massively this year.

Reality hit this January. We were revalued and everyone in the company was hailing the ESOP program and how much they were making now, and relishing in the returns. I checked my portfolio and saw NO CHANGE. So I started diving into it more. First thing is that any money the company gives up for your ESOP program such as 401k match, profit sharing, etc. goes into a low yield, low risk money market account to be held until the purchase of ESOP stocks.

1. ESOP stocks are purchased once per year in April. The company stock is a fixed quantity. There are only so many shares to go around. So, the only way to get stock is if someone else in the company sells theirs. No one can explain who gets precedent on the available shares. Since there are a fixed amount of stocks with a massive 1000+ employee company, what happens when there's not enough Stocks available to fulfill everyone's purchase in April.

2. ESOP stocks are purchased in April. The evaluation of the stock price change is in January. "The stock price has always risen." So, the price goes up and then you're allocated your stocks a few months later. Higher price means, less purchase power.

3. You cannot sell or trade your stocks with other members. The stocks are sold only after your employment ends. So you either have to retire, or quit/fired to get your ESOP stock money. They are only traded IN APRIL. If you get fired or quit in May, you have to wait until the following April to get your money from the ESOP program. But there's a catch, see #4.

4. When cashing out the ESOP, you only get a portion of the value per year. Your shares are sold over the period of 5 years and you are paid in May for each transaction. You can still accrue ESOP value through the stock evaluation changes and participate in the dividends and profit sharing but those go back into your ESOP account.

5. All bonuses, 401k matches, dividends, profit sharing go to the ESOP stock purchases. There's no election to take some cash in the meantime so you're stuck with the ESOP stocks.

6. Unlike a 401k, you do not have access to your ESOP money. If you need money desperately enough, you can cash out all or a portion of your 401k and depending on the type, pay a penalty but you can get money in a few days time. I used this option several times to pay for my kids college. With the ESOP program you cannot cash out any of the ESOP, but you apply for a loan from the company for the money you need, at an interest rate that is slightly higher than the 401k penalty rate.

In truth, the ESOP for retirement, if you plan on sticking around until that day, is a solid way to invest because, at least in my current company, the stock always goes up at a higher rate than most low-risk investments. However, since it's a stock price, the company is still hyper-focused on that metric. Everything is about raising the evaluation of the stock price, exactly like a publicly traded company. They are beholden to the private firms that evaluate the stock price, which is essentially, a made up number since it's not derived from the trading of said stock.
Click to expand...
In the 70s-80s, I worked at a corporate owned farm tractor store (think Deere, International, Case). We had an ESOP program. However, after 10 years they decided to no longer fund that and we had to cash out. I don't remember what I did with mine. It only amounted to about $1000. I don't think I took the cash, I do seem to remember rolling it into another investment. Just not sure anymore. And then a few years later the corporation divested themselves of all their company stores and mine was purchased by a group of local farmers, so I would have had to cash out then anyway.
 
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